Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to the Independence by Design podcast where we discuss what it means to be a business owner and ways to get unstuck from the day to day so we can design a business that gives us a life of independence.
[00:00:15] Speaker A: I think there's more AI hype out there than there is practical use cases because of how many companies and software tools and consultants are selling their services wrapped in AI.
Essentially there are, call it three to five of these powerhouse tools that we all have access to for, call it 20 to 60 bucks a month that can completely change your life if we know how to use them. And that is the entire purpose of today's conversation. I've got Tyler LaFleur on the show and he is a first principle thinker. And by first principles, I'm talking about how do things actually work? Like, how does that world actually work and what are the constraints based on our goals? And because at the end of the day, when we are trying to grow a company, cash is the constraint. We either have it or we don't. And we either have sustainable cash flow or we don't. And then in health, we either have healthy mitochondria or we don't. And that my favorite line from Elon Musk recently is, and it was, I was watching this founder's podcast about him. He says that in his world, physics is the judge, everything else is discretionary. And he know with a rocket it either blows up or it doesn't. And that's what we call deterministic. And a lot of things in life we have the first principal truth. But we need to be clear on our goal and then understand what the first principal constraints are. And then we can use one of these tools to accelerate our ability to get where we want to go faster and increase the probability that we get what we want.
And we don't have to over complicate this stuff. Tyler's going to come on to talk about his journey of his first principle thinking. And I wanted to specifically spend some time doing that so you understood how he thinks, because AI is about thinking and you can then trust his judgment of why. What he's saying, I think is val valuable. And we're gonna end the conversation with very practical ways to leverage the tools, figure out different business processes that you can automate and how to start just quit playing around with AI and actually start leveraging it to make more money and to get where you wanna go faster. And I spend my time giving the lens of how the ownership operating system can be the container to contextualize the activity or the tool that you're going to try and tackle and leverage AI for. So I really hope you enjoy this conversation. You find it practical, useful and a lot of takeaways. Thanks everybody for tuning in and enjoy the conversation with Tyler.
Well, I'm very excited for this conversation. Tyler.
[00:02:42] Speaker B: Yeah, this is, this is going to be fun.
[00:02:43] Speaker A: Yeah. Shout out to Jeff West.
[00:02:45] Speaker B: He.
[00:02:46] Speaker A: His podcast just came out last week, so I already had a lot of great feedback on it. Such a practical conversation on leadership. He is the one that introduced us. You started off in health and now are talking AI.
So what the hell's up? Why don't you give us a little bit of your. The story arc?
[00:03:04] Speaker B: Yeah. So I'll try and keep this short and sweet. So, yes, I'm a nurse by trade. I only finished because I met my wife in nursing school, so finished that out, had some pretty cool, I say, entrepreneurial jobs. Really young, right out of school and along that path, basically with my health background, I was tasked with figuring out how to implement functional medicine type testing in our toxicology lab. And through that journey went down a deep, dark rabbit hole with biohacking and functional medicine and testing and was introduced to a few CEOs that I was doing concierge medicine for. And I would say in the span of maybe 2 years, just given my background, I'm, I'm a very meticulous, you know, you would call me an integrator, not a visionary. So I'm in the weeds.
I'm, you know, obsessed with task management, project management, just for myself and working with these CEOs, from a health perspective, just talking about their business, their stresses. It kind of evolved into me giving some suggestions of how they would do it, asking me how I do it. And that evolved to me and my current business partner starting a fractional COO consulting business. We've had a couple leadership groups with CEOs. Business owners did that for a little while and figured out that instead of just meeting with them once a month and hearing about their problems and giving guidance, we would be more effective, you know, getting to their businesses, getting into the weeds and gaining more traction with them there. So probably about 18 months ago, maybe closer to two years by now, my partner mentioned, he's like, hey, you should probably dig into some of this AI stuff and figure out how we can use it. And I was, I say reluctant at first, probably had the same perception as most business owners now can't, you know, quote unquote, it can't do what I need it to do. And Like I always do, went deep down that rabbit hole, started programming some simple things and then tried to merge it with what I knew about operations and automating integrations. And here we are. Basically, the more you know, case studies I have and problems that come my way, I figure out new ways to, you know, leverage what's. What's currently available from an AI perspective to get it done.
[00:05:36] Speaker A: I love the backdrop you and I are going to dive into because we had a couple prep calls as we've gotten to know each other and I can only imagine if people would have gotten exposure to those.
[00:05:50] Speaker A: And we're going to have, I think, a very practical conversation. That's what I want to have and I think that's where we're going to go with this. So people listening in, it's not going to be in the sky and it's also not going to be too. I hope to balance it. And Tyler, what the hell is the common theme between nursing, your medical background, your health background, operations, business, AI? If you were to say, hey, this summarizes the through line of all of the things that you've been doing, what do you think it would be?
[00:06:23] Speaker B: First word that comes to mind is practical.
Really, not just theory. Right. I mean, I say from a nursing perspective, that's how I got into, you know, put myself through college, personal training, and I tell everyone I'm not a dietitian. You know, I've basically learned all this stuff, you know, so it's not what you're reading in an article. You know, everybody the debate around calories, macros, same thing for business. It's, you can, you know, read and watch and learn high level theory, but boots on the ground, practicality, how does this work? Like, how would we implement it? What is it going to do?
Avoiding black and white thinking, hey, it won't work because. And then tossing the baby out with the bathwater or, you know, how do we do this, what's available, what's the easiest, you know, and that's, I say that's always been the thing from health. You know, I've worked with guys that have paid tons of money from concierge, quote, unquote, you know, medical doctors and a lot the same in the business world. A lot of these medical doctors don't really understand, you know, how to apply this in everyday life. I mean, we all know certain themes, what we read, what makes sense. But then how do you apply that everyday life, what are the habits? But it's the same in business. I mean, that's really the same thing as understanding it, breaking it down, you know, first principles, like we always talk about, you know, it's just first principles thinking, and then how do we apply this? Who needs to do it? How do they do it?
And then what are the swim lanes and the workflows and then bridging that together. And a lot of the guys I work with are quote unquote visionaries, so getting into the weeds, it makes them nauseous. Like they do not want anything to do with the details.
[00:08:11] Speaker A: So super fascinating that you mentioned because, because I wrote down first principles and outcome driven, and I'm curious.
And, and.
[00:08:21] Speaker A: When I think about, like, you, even the health conversations that we've had, like, because you can have first principles and then it's the outcome where I, I'm correlating the out outcome to being practical because you have to actually, like, it's. You either get the outcome or you don't. Right. Where does, where did, where did this drive come from, Tyler? And, and that's first qu. First part of the question then also, like, how did that. This drive of the first principle and the outcome that you have, how does that run into, like the academic or the, the, the status quo, which the propaganda tells you it should be something else compared to what the first pr. Because you're, You're. You're having to fight it, you know, go against the grain.
[00:09:09] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, well, that's a loaded question from a health perspective.
It doesn't take much digging to figure out, you know, I say the American healthcare model, you know, from an insurance perspective, what's driving that? Right? And you can go look Even a simple ChatGPT query of give me the most popular functional medicine, you know, as far as whatever codes, you know, insurance codes, ICD9, whatever they are.
And then you could take the top conventional ICD9 codes, billing codes, and look at the reimbursement.
And it is. You cannot make a living.
[00:09:48] Speaker A: I would love to do this. I've never done that.
[00:09:50] Speaker B: You cannot make a living billing insurance from a functional medicine perspective. But if you show the outcomes which the American healthcare system is not outcomes based. If you show the outcomes based on those billing codes, as opposed to the conventional codes, it's night and day. But if you look at the reimbursement for those, it's the opposite. Night and day. Right. So it's figuring out, oh, you know, if it's. Now, look, if there's like. Yeah, but if there's surgery or something involved, I tell people, like, look, if you break your Leg. You need to go to the er. I'm not gonna, you know, wave some sage and rub crystals and it's gonna heal, man.
[00:10:31] Speaker A: I believe you.
[00:10:33] Speaker B: It's. I mean, there's a place for it. Yeah, there's a. There's a place for it, but from a, you know, lifestyle, you know, aging perspective, just anything to do with blood sugar, inflammation, you know, anything of that.
[00:10:47] Speaker A: Nature, stress, hormones, blood work. Yeah, if.
[00:10:50] Speaker B: Yeah, conventional medical doctors, they.
To say they understand it. Yes, some of them do. But to apply that to, hey, what am I doing that is driving these things.
No. And they just. They don't understand to that level because they're paid to not understand that.
[00:11:08] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, it's a Peter AT T. I mean, like, literally I said as a one of the top MDs, I. He never got one source of training on diet, nutrition, exercise.
Where did. And this is. This is helping me get validity to or confirmation of my quote that I have said that doctors are health insurance, are insurance salespeople.
[00:11:29] Speaker A: So it's, you know, follow the money, follow the incentives. And so where did, like, you got. You went through your formal education. So, like, was it your own desire for your own outcomes? Because the reason I'm. I'm spending some time on this, Tyler, is like, when we get into AI, I want to understand how people think, because AI becomes a thinking partner based on what we know and the outcomes that we're striving for. So I'm just trying to get an understanding for you or for the listeners, like how you think and how you got there. Because it takes a lot of work to go against the grain, I mean, of what you were taught and then what is being told out there. Because you could have just said, fine, I'm willing to work within the system. How come. How come you said no?
[00:12:14] Speaker B: Well, yeah, I guess my personality. I'm a bit of a iconoplast, right. I do not enjoy doing what everyone else is doing. So at some point it's. Why are we doing this? I'm not doing it. I don't know. I'd say a lot of my.
I guess as much as I've thought about this, a lot of my drive. So I am a younger. I'm the youngest of my family, but I'm a younger brother, and my brother was always good at sports, smart. You know, we always joke like he was the golden child. So I was always in the shadow, right. And then getting into high school, you know, no one in my family played soccer and everything was about baseball and football. So I played soccer and I don't.
[00:12:58] Speaker A: Know if we talked about that. What was your position?
[00:13:00] Speaker B: I was a defender.
[00:13:01] Speaker A: I was stopper.
[00:13:03] Speaker B: Yeah. What's that? Is that like a sleeper?
[00:13:05] Speaker A: That was, that was right in front of the sweeper. So it was the mid. Mid D. Right in front of the sweeper.
[00:13:10] Speaker B: Yeah, I was in. I, I really, you know, I say as far as soccer skill, true soccer skills compared to, you know, real soccer players, the.
My technical skill set wasn't there. I was, you know, when I stopped playing football and baseball, like I said, growing up, being in the shadow, I thought, well, if I can be bigger, faster and stronger than my older brother or anyone else, that'll, you know, help me. Which is stupid. Teenage ego, right?
So, yeah, I started lifting, you know, twice a day. You know, digging into it was just about being bigger. It wasn't anything to do with health. It was bigger, faster, stronger. And you know, I say learning from. I had a few bodybuilder buddies that I met at the gym that kind of, I say, groomed me of. And explaining, you know, certain aspects of growth and all this stuff. And then I just, I say I'm a nerd at heart. I'm always wanting to learn, you know, all the mechanisms and why and all this stuff. So I mean, that's really the. The basis of it. So I've essentially just learned how. I tell most people I've learned how to play the number two role really well, like from a support. I don't have to be in the front.
I will be behind the person in the front, but I also will be respected. You know, there's a. There's a peer type relationship. Right. And that's carried over from the concierge side of things and then getting into the business side of things. It's the same thing. It's where their weaknesses. Where can I fill gaps? And that's basically what I just learned to do.
[00:14:51] Speaker A: Is that. So I'm making a connection between the learning number two and helping do the execution. Two first principles were the outcome and practical explain a little bit more about what you mean by that. And like how. How do you wrap your head around like, what is the goal and like. And how did like first principles play a part?
[00:15:14] Speaker B: Well, you mentioning that. So along the journey when we were. We still had the toxicology lab, I was pulled into the same leadership course that Jeff west, where we actually met was Dr. Thayer's. Oh, really? Yeah. I didn't know that.
[00:15:30] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:15:30] Speaker B: Yeah. So I, I mean, I, like I said I got Pulled into it just being the youngest minority partner in the toxicology lab. So two of the other partners were doing it.
My current business partner was our, you know, business consultant. And he was like, I think you guys should pull Tyler in and have him do it. Well, I, It. It rocked my world. I mean, all doctor Theater stuff, you know, I'm sure most of the things that Jeff spoke about on the podcast changes your thinking, you know, to where even the questions, which is the majority of what the, you know, the whole I say paradigm or thesis around, you know, Dr. Thayer was around leadership was the curiosity and the questions. So asking the right question at the right time, that was another thing that learning. I say how to do that, continuing to learn how to do that, that's kind of been, I don't know, I say like a launch pad for working with these business owners or working with CEOs. Whether it's health, business, it's.
The standout is I'm asking questions that either most physicians won't ask or consultants won't ask or they don't know how to ask. You know, they're scared to ask certain questions.
I am not. Most people that have worked with me in the past, or if they refer, I will ask right off the bat, what have you heard?
And so I want to make sure we're on the same page with what does this look like? And I told you, one of our first calls, if I feel as though I care more about your business or your health than you do, I can't work with you. Like, you have to have some skin in the game so much.
I mean, you think about it like it's the same as.
Same as. I mean, there's some employees that are, you know, really good employees. And the reason is because they, they need this job, right? And it's. They can be good at it. They cannot be good at it. But you watch the necessity drives whatever personality change, you know, communication. Where's the necessity? And that's. That's essentially the drive. So if. If I have a guy, you know, or girl, hey, I have these issues.
Can you help me? And I start asking the questions around, you know, the necessity of, like, why. Why do you want to do this? Like, you, you're 50 years old and you want a six pack. Okay, great. Why, like, take. Take steroids. I don't know what to tell you, you know, and no, no, it's not just the six pack. Okay, now we're getting something same for the business.
Like, what do you want? Same thing you do. You Know when you ask them, like, what is the goal?
And look, that's another big thing. It can be with health or it can be with business.
If you're telling me your goals, and I'm looking at either the actions, the organizational calendar, what are the different workflows, processes, like, how does this business serve the customers? How does it make money? And you're telling me your goal is this. And then you're looking at either their calendar, their task list, what are they doing? And it doesn't match up. And when you start asking a question, why are you doing this?
You'll frustrate and rub people the wrong way sometimes and you'll get some bullshit.
[00:18:35] Speaker B: Love it so much.
[00:18:36] Speaker A: I have not met someone that is as much like me in this aspect ever. Tyler. Like, like, that's why, like, our first meeting was like a half, it was supposed to be half hours. Like, what, two hours?
[00:18:47] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:18:47] Speaker A: And I was like, hey, hey, Jeff. Tyler And I hit it off. He's like, not shocked. And that's why I introduced you guys. But like, okay, so how did you get like this, though? Because, like, I have had to figure out, like, where I got like this because it'll, it breaks my brain. Like, I want to run an Iron man, and someone's smoking cigarettes, eat McDonald's. I'm like, why am I. My brain breaks. So how did you. Because it's a lot of freaking work, dude, to rub people and rub the status quo the wrong way.
So, like, like, I'm just curious. Like, it just, it just, I'm just so, it's, I just laugh because of how hilariously similar we are in this aspect.
[00:19:22] Speaker B: And look, I don't, I don't know. It's got to be the, I say the, the third child in me, right?
[00:19:27] Speaker A: I was the oldest, though. So now what?
[00:19:29] Speaker B: Yeah, I, I don't know, but I know where mine came from. And it was always fighting to be something and learning. You know, I, I, I always laugh for our whatever senior year, you know, you get these awards, you know, for class, whatever.
And my dad ended up coming to one of those award ceremonies. He was one that, I mean, he was there, you know, for most things that we would do, but as ridiculous as some of these banquets and stuff are, and I got brown nose, Wittiest and Grouch. And when we got in the car, my dad was laughing and he was like, he's like, great. He's like, I raised the class.
And I started thinking about it and I'm like.
[00:20:16] Speaker B: Okay, yeah, it's one of those things. It's. I don't know. I say what gets me in trouble the most is my mouth, you know, so I've learned to tame that with my wife, my kids. But outside of a certain circle, it comes in handy if it's used correctly. Right. So it's. It was just part of the personality. But Dr. Thayer's stuff, I mean, I took.
[00:20:38] Speaker A: Gave you some rounding out of the edges, huh? I'm still working on that. According to my audience that's on my YouTube and my podcast is I interrupt my audience, my guest, too much. So I.
[00:20:49] Speaker B: It's your show. It's your show. You control the direction.
[00:20:52] Speaker A: Yeah, maybe a little. Maybe a little too much. So what I.
This is so helpful because I want to get into the nitty gritty of the AI conversation. But what I think is so fascinating, if people have been listening to me long enough, is the correlations between health and business that I'm constantly making even before meeting you. First principles of like. Because, like, when I think about health, it's like we either wake up and feel good with natural energy or we don't. It's like it becomes a binary thing. And like, you either are healthy or not. You have mitochondria, health or not. And like, with business, it took me 11 years to come up with the first principles of, you either have more time, more cash flow, and more equity, or you don't. And every single thing correlates with that. And so what I learned and what you and I were talking about in the prep call is like, those first principles allow me, so I think, anyways, to be able to unpack people's goals, because most. I realize that most people don't have a clear understanding of their goals, so then therefore, they don't understand how their actions are getting them to a goal or not. So it's like there's two things that had to be figured out for me in order to help people without telling them what to do. Because I don't want to be told what to do. I just. I think that, like, to treat some other human being the right way, like the behaviors that you were just talking about is if we. If we help someone understand their goal clearly, then we can help someone see how their actions may or may not be aligned with that goal and then what to do about it. And then it's their choice of whether you want to overcome the hard stuff to get there. And AI is wildly.
[00:22:34] Speaker A: Like. It's like it's a rocket ship inside of this kind of Framework, but without it, it becomes like a total loose cannon slop. And so like, that's why I was. I appreciate what you were explaining and how your brain works and how the first principles work. So as you are working towards them, you know, getting into business.
So like, what was like, as you started in like the US integrator operational role, what were some of the things that you were seeing?
So take us kind of like before the AI revolution in 2022, like, what were you seeing? And like, what was your role?
And what were some of the themes that you were seeing?
[00:23:10] Speaker B: I mean, one of the main themes was from a. I say organizational, project management, task management roles, you know, everyone has. Well, I'll say everyone. That's another thing. Most people don't even have an org chart, right? So it's understood. But show me, right? Or they show it to you and then you ask someone else and it's different, right? So there's no document control.
The biggest theme is they talk and they do not assign. Who's doing, what are their deadlines? How do we circle back to see the progress?
Because these guys, I say this contextually for the guys I work with, like I said, they're mainly visionaries. They're phenomenal at getting people convinced to work for their company. They're great salesmen, right? They're phenomenal developers. They can integrate businesses, all these different things, but they cannot sit down and do it themselves. They did it and then once. They did it once and they, you know, got some capital revenue, they hired people to do it. But there's this theme of like, I don't want to be a micromanager, right? And so they say things once and tell someone what their role is. And as a company grows, there's just, there's no other delineation.
So they find themselves buried in bullshit fires, people knocking on their door, calling them, and they will give an answer, right? And then that's it. There's no thinking of, do we have a process to this? Is it documented? Is it?
[00:24:46] Speaker A: What's the return?
[00:24:47] Speaker B: What's the goal?
Who's doing what, how are we reporting on this? And then even the ones you are doing, why are we still doing these? Right? And most of the time, again, I listen to all these CEOs that are frustrated with. When you ask my employees, the response is, this is the way we've always done it. I'm like, you are doing the same thing.
It is just a mirror. Like, you basically get what you tolerate. And most of the time there's Certain things they don't tolerate, but they can't hire people just like them.
Oh, we have great salesmen. Okay, then you will not get shit done as a business. And I mean it's, it's true like.
[00:25:26] Speaker A: That or it's the engineer that hires more engineers or the technician that hires more technicians. I mean it's eth thing. You're painting the picture of.
[00:25:37] Speaker A: The owner operator dynamic that I have been talking about where there's the owner and the operator who are both one and the person is starting out by an operator, whether it's second gen, first gen, they bought the company, but they're an operator and then they're the owner. And what I have realized is so let me, let me reciprocate or like rally on a couple of the comments to see what your your $0.02 is. So I think the why behind some of those things that you're talking about is okay, so someone gets into business for independence, which is kind of my thesis. It's like okay, I want to be able to do whatever I want.
And visionaries and know owner operators are generally good at their trade. So then they're gravitated to more of the thing that they're good at and they enjoy with their flow zone and then they avoid all the other that they don't want to do. So the moment that the company gets to a revenue, gross margins and cash flow and it's going to be lumpy because it's going to be a combination of salary and a K1 and it's not sustainable K1s and distributions, not sustainable distributions. It's a random K1 tied to random shit. And so there's this, hey, by the way, I'm going to keep doing things I love and the moment I have money to just not like I want to do I want, I want to. They're going to keep getting gravitated towards the things they love and avoidance of the things that they hate. But there's no objective framework from the ownership board perspective to say what is the freaking game that we're playing? Which is the game of capital and capitalism, which is okay, there is a rate of return of cash flow that's also tied to the equity valuation and we need the financials to objectively see this. And so all the. So like what, what's fascinating because I'm similar to that visionary as well, my father dude is like that is why I'm similar to you is because it was total a ball of chaos. There was no org chart for 115 people, I mean, it was just a wild, wild west. Sell more shit, there will hopefully be more money. And the. I had to be the antidote, even though I didn't want to be Tyler. What happened was. Is like, it was all emotions until I was like, none of this is emotional, actually. Like, we either have a certain working capital, a certain set of distributions and a certain valuation, or we don't. It has nothing to do with Corey Orion's opinion. And so it's this weird, like, okay, I understand the dynamics that you're explaining because I've lived it, and I think a lot of people listening in live it. But then there is this antidote. Kind of like when I think about health, it's like, okay, well, you know, we realize that there is a universal truth that is objective, not subjective. And there's a game being played here. Then we can contextualize all of that hard that has to be done.
[00:28:14] Speaker B: What do.
[00:28:14] Speaker A: What are your thoughts on that?
[00:28:16] Speaker B: I mean, I.
Going back to.
I say I'm thinking from an AI perspective. Everything you just mentioned, which is, you know, the theme of telling a visionary, hey, let's meet, you know, annually, right? And what they want to talk about is growth, right? How are we going to either save money or make more money? That's what interests them, right? Looking at which pieces of the machine, how does the machine work, you know, which cogs touch what. They don't want anything to do with it. So either they're passive and they encourage their team, you know, to think of this and, you know, integrate themselves, or they start slamming their fist on the table and out of fear, get people to, you know, move their ass. Right?
But so two things. When you were talking about the goals and everything's about, you know, revenue, capital.
There was a. One of our guys, I don't even know if it was someone else's saying, you know, or quote, but it always stuck with me and is when there is no goal or definitive goal, the default is always more.
Right. So what are your goals?
[00:29:25] Speaker A: I like that.
[00:29:27] Speaker B: And they can't tell you how much or they'll pull it out the sky like we talked about. You know, one of our last calls, it's like, oh, well, we're making, you know, 3 million, you know, annual revenue. I want to get to 10 next year.
Okay.
You know.
Yeah, we will just do a little bit. Yeah. A little bit more than triple of what we're doing. And it'll. It'll equate. And if you present that to them, they know it's not that simple. But that's how they responded to you, right? It's like, oh, so, man, that's great. How are you going to do that?
And you get this. Like, they know they can't say, sell more, right? Like, they know that their answer is going to be just fall flat on the space. But from an AI perspective, everything you just mentioned, even if you just do everything once, right, Any decision you make, we've never had the opportunity, the technology, the ability to have something that can take all of this information.
And any question you're asking it, it bounces it off all of the information and then it responds back to you. So from a strategy perspective, execution, whatever it may be, you've never had this. And I've been business consulting for, I don't know, it's close to 10 years now. You know, like, you think about all the stuff we used to do five years ago, and I had to gain all that information, ask these questions. You're doing it in, you know, I say seconds and minutes when that would take hours. You know, just expertise, whatever it may be. So I don't know. I mean, the thing that I've experienced, and I only have, you know, my subset of CEOs and business owners I've worked with, it's the ones that feel stuck, whatever it may be. It's that they talk about, hey, this is what I want to do. Okay, now let's break that down. Like you mentioned on the last call, fractals. I mean, I say, I think in fractals, right? It's this. Okay, now what does that look like? How does this connect? Who's doing this? You know, even as simple as we're gonna start doing, maybe it's a new business line or, hey, you have an employee that is a rock star. Let's just put more on them, right? And make them ineffective.
But we're not doing anything else with the people who suck or, you know, the herbies of the. Of the organization. So it's a.
I. I'm saying the word lazy. I mean, we all have our own lazy, right? And for them, they have so much on their mind that breaking down who's going to be doing what and how we're actually going to get there.
It's painful. They will push that off, you know, any. Any opportunity they can.
[00:32:14] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, I. Yeah, it's okay. So I love it. I'm trying to figure out what to grab onto there because there's two couple of things here, Tyler, and. And then we'll build a swim. I Think as we bounce across some of these barriers, into some of the gory details, as, as towards the end of it, I think all of this context is important.
Same thing with AI, right?
We're bringing the people on the journey. Just like, yeah, but like, and this is why I'm going to start with the goal. So when you and I were on that call last week and we were talking about, okay, because what I, I, I think maybe I'll start with a couple beliefs. I believe that we can delegate like crazy, as that's what a board does. We can delegate all of the operations and pull the levers and guide the levers through decision making. Tyler, we can sit because, like, at the end of the day, when we're playing the game of business from the boardroom, it's really like, okay, how do we make decisions against people's time and money? That's literally it. It's like, and I know it sounds so fluffy for everybody, everybody hears time and money from every freaking marketer on the planet. But in the actual practical sense, we're delegating and deploying time and money, time through our payroll and what our people are going to be doing. And then money. What's the effing rate of return?
And we can see that rate of return in the cash flow statement. So we're taking the discounted cash flow of the future cash flow. So we say, okay, every single year this company is going to generate it's a half a million, then a million, then 1.5, then 2. But real money, real cash. Not gross margins, not net income, not fucking normalized ebitda, but actual real money. I had a guy in Silicon Valley go, you mean like real cash, Ryan? I'm like, no, nft or like, no real, actual money that you can pay a freaking debt payment with and, like, you could, you know, take out of your checking account. So, okay, with that being said, that is the constraint. Like what I, when I think about kind of like my before and after, Tyler, I got a D in accounting, man. Like, I didn't know how any of this worked. And I was doing the revenue, the gross margins. Look at the bank account with a $20 million company.
But now it's like, okay, so let's start with the goal for a second, where this is where I'm going to head, where I'm going to explain the goal.
And then I want to talk about how all of the operations should be able to have a peg to that goal. We can see the connection. So we would say, okay, Tyler, you Want your company to be, what Was your example? 5 to 10 million bucks?
[00:34:45] Speaker B: 3. 3 to 10.
[00:34:46] Speaker A: 3 to 10. Okay. Yeah, because you're over triple. It's like, okay, how, how many years? So we could like actually explain. Like we have to build out what's the income statement, like what revenue lines are going to be doing and then what's the cost of goods lines and what gross margin towards each of those revenue lines? What's the SGA and overhead?
And then what does the balance sheet look like? Payables, receivables, inventory, debt, taxes. And like you go all the way through all three financial statements and clearly explain what the company would look like if in a couple years and then you reverse engineer it to today and you go, that is a what, 50% compound annual growth rate and you have no cash flow from operations the whole time. So then your, your question is, okay, do you take a line of credit on, do you take on mezz financing? Do you get, you know, raise equity? And what I normally do to tell other people, I go, we, I do that kind of that, that dynamic. People go, well I don't want to raise money. I'm like, okay, well I'm at Jerome Powell, we can't print money ever. But so, so you have to either move the goal back, reduce the goal, but like it's understanding the, the edges of, you know, like Elon Musk says always like physics is the, the real judge. Everything else is, is subjective.
So that's kind of like describing in great detail where you want to go on vacation and then everything in between of the choose your own adventure becomes. But you can kind of then sort of playing with the goal and then playing with the how. But without that goal and that objective truth of the income statement, balance sheet and cash flow statement, everybody like every decision is a idea not tethered to any constraint.
[00:36:27] Speaker B: Well and all that, plus like you said, if it's night and day for in three years, this is what we're going to do. Looking at today, it's not only, oh, we have to change, we're not going to sell this offering or we're going to change how we're currently selling this offering or giving this offering, whatever it may be.
[00:36:50] Speaker B: You'Re actually having to look at that I say organizational habits.
So a lot of things have to change. If not, you just fall back into the ruts and you can have your annual goal meeting, whatever with your team. Well, when they get back to the desk, guess what? Like that, that initial high that they feel right the Euphoria of, oh, yeah, we're excited, the dopamine hit and they get back to their desk and they're still spending three hours for bullshit emails or five hours in meetings that should have been emails. You know, that's one of my big things. It's like, oh, we're having a meeting to do what?
And they're like, oh, discuss this.
Here's the PowerPoint. I'm like, no, no, we're not taking any time in this meeting meeting for a PowerPoint. You're going to send that out if that's what you want to do, and then ask specific questions. And if you can't, you know, basically get consensus, then you can have a meeting to discuss whatever. But as far as having a meeting for someone to present some bullshit, it's like, great. So how much are you paying? I don't know if you've ever heard of. They used to talk about it. I'm sure it's more sophisticated now. It was called, like the Meeting Minder. And it was essentially an Excel spreadsheet that had all the employees and then all of their annual salaries. And so whoever was in the meeting, they would pull them over. And then every second, basically you're looking at the amount of money this meeting's costing and you show it to the CEOs, and it's like, okay, now multiply this by however much. That's how much you're wasting just on the culture, right? But another thing you mentioned, as far as the goal. And then, okay, this is the objective reality, right? This is what it would have to look like or what you would need to do.
[00:38:32] Speaker B: They're still bridging the gap of even if you did that one exercise annually, month over month, week over week, I mean, you're looking at this. Same for weight loss. I always tell people, weight loss is not a slope. It looks like a bad stock investment, right? So you have this, it's doing this. But if you look at the line over time, it should be going down.
Same for business and growth. Oh, we should be that. Everybody wants this hockey stick. And it's like, okay, well, hope isn't a method. So what are we doing? Right? But most, I say most of my guys do not.
Once they have that conversation, you know, they've met with someone like you, they have the finances, you know, the, all the accounting, the revenue, the income statement, all this stuff.
Now ask them to look at that. And which data points KPIs do they need to look at week over week, month over month, to see Are they tracking right? You better build a dashboard that has colors on it because looking at the numbers, they won't do it. And again, more to AI it's like you're talking which was a full time role, what two or three years ago now you can build, you know, an agent that's yours that has its own data set. It pulls data from where you're already using it, QuickBooks, whatever it may be.
You can pull that and it has its own prompt with how do you want it to respond to you? I mean there's certain things now that really aren't that complex. And if people knew that they could have it, right? Like, oh, I could just have something that would send me whatever every week. Yes. And then you still have to make the decisions. Right. That is your role as CEO is you're gonna live or die. Yeah, you're gonna live or die against the goal.
[00:40:17] Speaker A: And I think so. Okay, I love where you're headed with this. So.
[00:40:22] Speaker A: I fundamentally believe that we have to have that goal.
Unbelievable. Like completely articulated and clear in the financials. But the, the financials become the peg. Like it's almost like all the body like whatever metrics that you would do. Tyler. Like.
[00:40:41] Speaker A: It'S not that I love that stuff so much, it's just that's the game scoreboard. So it's like I want the freedom and I want the. I'm the. I'm inherently a visionary and optimist but like I have to have that to have the objective reality. So we have to clarify all that those financials and the. And then we can go and we can start looking at strategies. So this is where my ownership operating system comes in with the nine modules and they have this order which is like the Fibonacci sequence. Right. Can it spawns out tied to objective reality. And then we can start looking on if we have that goal clear, the timeline clear and we have a rough understanding, then we can start applying people and AI, people and technology to what type of strategy do we have? What type of sales and marketing process do we have? What type of operational process do we have? What type of financial process do we have tied to the objective truth of the financials and the cash position is either yes or no.
[00:41:42] Speaker B: Right.
[00:41:43] Speaker A: What I said to you last week is like the challenge that I've seen is like every single marketing consultant, sales consultant, EOS implementer strategy, like people are not tying it to reality of the objective truth. So then whether it's the way I look at it is like even if someone's paying 20 grand for a consultant or they're going to go build their own GPT bot.
The same result happens, which is like you have no, it's, it's a puzzle piece that doesn't have the rest of the puzzle. So like how do you, does that make sense? How do you, how can you help me pick this up? Like how do we deal with this?
[00:42:21] Speaker B: So you mentioned, you mentioned the, when you were saying the sales and marketing strategy, right? And even the finances.
What's our operational strategy? All these different things. Think of that's for your company, right? And you compare that to the goal. Do they all match up?
Think two years ago, three years ago, whenever, even just with Google where if you were like, I wonder how we compare to other businesses of our size? Like what are they doing? How are they doing it differently?
Just AI. The sexy piece in business is the automations, like building specific coded web apps just for your business. Yes, that's sexy. You also have Google on steroids, right? So when you start asking questions for data, showing your data, giving it the size, your demographic, all these different things. Now ask your questions, right? But what most people do is just, just like they're googling, right? They just kind of vomit into the chat and then they're like, this thing's garbage, man. It's telling me stuff I already know. Show me your prompt and they'll send it. And I'm like, this is sad. Like that's you expected to get answers for your business with this. So what does this tell me about where you're doing this elsewhere, right? So there's a.
[00:43:44] Speaker B: And look, I'm always going to go back to what I've seen. Like you said, the reality, the reality is some businesses spend the time to dig into connecting the dots. Like we're talking about what's the actual goal. A lot of them just stop there. Hey, we have our annual planning, we have the goal.
Let's go.
Execute. Rah rah. Everybody's excited. Nothing happens. Or if they do it, how are they measuring against it? Right? So, and look, we're talking like we're operating inside of a vacuum.
Like you still have the economy, you still have, you know, politics, you have all these different things driving and it could change overnight, right? So you got to have some sort of contingency planning, but sticking with what are we doing? What do we need? Who do we need? Because a default with most business owners is they throw money or people at problems.
So when they have an issue, it's not, hey, let's Reassess how we're doing this, right. Me and my partner call it like a white sheet of paper exercise. So similar to what you're talking about, if a business, you know, has been growing and successful, let's say for five years, and then you get to a point that we're doing our annual planning and you ask them, hey, instead of planning for next year, if you were starting this business now, how would you do it different? How should you do it? And a lot of the times what comes from that is they're still doing something that they have no business doing, but it's going to be a pain in the ass to unravel. But it's just sucking cash, right? They're like, they'll make an excuse, they'll justify it. But even having someone like you, like if you're breaking down the financials just purely from the business perspective, not going out and finding just a fractional CFO that doesn't really understand your business, they understand the numbers, but they're not going to ask the right questions, right? Having something that bridges that gap and continues to kick them in the ass to look at it. And what are we not measuring, you know, that we should be whatever it is those KPIs, just building the framework, I would tell you, is significant, you know, for most business owners, like, how do you show the KPIs are actually driving all these bigger, you know, the outcomes.
[00:45:59] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, the outcomes. And so let's, let's dive into a couple of these and because I, I want to get us to some of the practical tools that you're using and how you're creating some. Because I want to get people to a low hanging fruit by the end of this call and, but I think, you know, I'll throw in a couple more edges. I'm keeping, I don't know, I'm just on the word edges, right? Like it's like, okay, like there are like actual constraints so that are tied to the goal. So if we want our revenue to be 30 million, well, I'll just, I'll use some, I got, I got a couple of clients right now that have very similar set of financial styles. So they're, they're, they're, they're going to end the year about 30 million. They want 50 million by 2030.
Call like four goals for four years. It's, it's not a, it's not a crazy growth rate. It's very modest. And then with the working capital needs that they have, the debt that they have, the distributions that they need. I mean, it's so like 3 million in 2.8 to 3 million in normalized EBITDA to 5, 30 million to 5 to 50 million. I mean it's. That ends up being like a $35 million valuation on 7 multiple. Like super reasonable, to be honest. Now we have the ability to see, okay, one of them. Like let's say on average it's like 10% working capital of revenue. So we know that payables, receivables and inventory. So hopefully people are following me here. 30 to 50 million. 3 million. I normalize E to 5 million and you're going to get to a 7 multiple. If working capital, which is payables, receivables and inventory is 10% of revenue. And let's say we have no debt right now, that accumulates around 15 to 20 million in cash, which means we have. We're accumulating cash, which is fantastic. So that becomes like the box say, okay, well we have to make sure that in that one of them was like a 10% growth rate in revenue. I think that's ended up what it being. And so.
[00:47:49] Speaker A: What are we selling and to who is a good effing question. And then the KPI that I love and I'm just insanely stubborn on is your customer journey. So I think people having strategic planning, sales and marketing as silos is a total freaking insanity play. That's like someone I had a doctor that told my sister, we isolated your hormone.
Like, what? How do you ice. It's part of the freaking what? It's part of the machine. You can't isolate a hormone.
So it just, it's like it doesn't even. It breaks my brain. So when I say this is like the, the sales, marketing and strategy, it's in a practical sense, Tyler. We need revenue to land on the income statement every month, predictably.
And so if you're selling a product and a service, and maybe it's both, a lot of my clients do both product and service.
We have separate revenue lines. And each of those revenue lines you have a customer journey from all the random shit that you're doing to the person to you grab an email, then you grab a phone call, discovery call, and then you have client acquisition costs. So in my old industry, Tyler, it used to be 20% of gross profit you could spend to acquire that company or that customer. If it's more than that. Like when I finally figured out that metric, I was spending 25, which means it's not a good deal.
And you bounce that against the lifetime value of that customer. And I don't give a shit.
Paid ads, trade shows, like, it's like the world of the how you do that is like infinite. But like, we can't ignore the constraint of you have to spend only a certain amount of gross profit to acquire a customer. So then therefore, like, I want to lob it over to you to say, okay, and maybe we take these from like the sales, the gross profit and then the overhead, and we can kind of just volley back and forth of like, how you would think about, you know, applying AI and thinking to this. So within that framework, that's where I think the visionary can then hand over to the operations going, dude, like, now the constraint is there.
What do we do with this? Like, what kind of things for sales marketing strategy? Like, but we now know that we have 20% of gross profit, has to acquire this many rev these much revenue and clients every single month for the next four years.
[00:50:11] Speaker B: So I would say a hypothetical constraint, right? So the question is, how do you prove that this is actually the constraint operationally in the business, Right? So everything you just said, all those, the strategy, if you will. When I said in fractals, I usually when I whiteboard this, I go down from the main one and you're asking all the typical questions, what drives this? Like, what's connected to this? And when they start explaining it to you. Because if you ask some people, like, hey, what is the, like you said, the client journey, like, what is the purpose of this organization? What does it do? Right? And they'll tell you all the different departments when you start breaking down from the goal, right? And usually I'm not, I say finance driven, right? I'm operationally driven. So we have a fractional CFO that we work with because she was an ops and she's, you know, pretty good. So I don't know. I. I don't do any of the financials. I mean, I'll leverage AI like crazy for that. But if I'm breaking down whatever that strategy is and you start getting down to someone else's, let's say you have. Everyone in the organization has role descriptions like, okay, what's their title? What are they responsible for? Which KPIs, all their responsibilities, they're listed or you need to list them. And if you had that entire bucket, you know, of all the responsibilities, you would tell me. All of these drive the business. This is how we do what we do in all aspects of it. Great. At some point at the bottom of our whiteboard, you should have those responsibilities. So what you're trying to do is go from the goal all the way down. What happens is you agree on the goal, so they meet with you, they go through this whole exercise and it's like, all right, it makes sense. I know what we need to do. Great. Now, operationally, how do we do that? And at some point, going down, usually around halfway, they can't connect.
Oh, we're going to have to do this. Well, it's because either you don't have the people to execute on that, you don't have the time to execute on that, you can't go, like you said, from a capital perspective, you're going to break all your rules that we've already agreed to. Right. So somewhere along the lines, what I'd say I'm good at is when you break it down to just the Lego pieces, how are we going to do this to where we can hit these goals? What do we have to stop? What do we have to do different?
What can we automate.
[00:52:44] Speaker B: Again? We talked about this on our call. Most business owners, it's black and white, it's, oh, we're going to use AI and they just force whatever they can to try and get AI to do. Or they try it once, they don't like the response, it's inaccurate, whatever it may be, and they stop. Like, it won't work for us. Right. So everything you're talking about, I'll tell you, I'm not a financial.
[00:53:06] Speaker A: But this is where. Sorry to interrupt, but sorry everybody.
[00:53:10] Speaker B: Is my podcast, my rules.
[00:53:14] Speaker A: I'm going to have fun with that for a while. But this is why you and I are collaborating. Because what I'm excited about and I, you know, and I'm. And maybe I can almost tweak how I was teeing you up a little bit.
[00:53:28] Speaker A: What you know, to be as clear for everybody listening, I think that the only way to deploy a Tyler and I like, I want to give you the rocket fuel. Frickin blast the shit to the moon, dude. If we don't do everything that I have described, it's a total screw job because you are putting a rocket ship and pointing it. What did you say? When there is no goal, the definite answer is more. And what is it? What's the Alice in Wonderland? If you don't know where you're going, any place will do. It's just. It's total insanity. So, like, what I'm guessing, you know, I want to give you the liberty to do. To go finally, if someone comes to you Tyler, with that clarity of here's what, like the 30 to 50, the 3 million to normalize you to the 5, we got this kind of. We got 10% of working capital. Our inventory can't be more than this. The receivables have to be this. Our client acquisition cost has to be 30% of gross profit. Our gross profit is going to be this.
All right, dude, now what? And so like, now that's where I want you to take a moment because, like, if we don't maybe two parts comment on if someone doesn't do what I just described, what can go wrong and then if someone does do what I just described, what can go right? And how do you and AI get set loose?
[00:54:44] Speaker B: Yeah, what can go wrong is you build your ladder on the wrong wall.
So whatever you're doing, one liner. Yeah, I mean, it's true, it's successful as far as we built this. Now, does it match at all to your goals for the business, for you personally, financially, whatever? No. Right. Because again, we're not operating. Business is not in a vacuum. So we can have whatever plan and strategy.
And if you don't truly understand it, and if you're not, you know, I say measuring it, I'm talking about week over week to assess the trajectory. Then how do you know? Like, how do you course. Correct. Right? You don't. You just keep operating at the end of the month, like, oh, we're this far off, you know, okay, well, let's do better. You know, I listen to some of these meetings and I'm like, bro, don't ever. Yeah, you stop. Get someone else to run this meeting because this is terrible.
But what you were asking me, I mean, what could go right is obvious, right? It either you think you know how you're going to do it, but if you have agreed that these numbers make sense, like you said, it's nothing astronomical, like, this is very feasible to do. Right? If that's the case, well then if you don't know how you're going to do it over the next three years, what problems are presenting themselves? Like what assumptions or hypotheses are getting debunked, if you will.
You asked me what I would do and that honest answer is that I would basically plug that entire. All of the financial strategy. Everything else, I would upload that into like an AI database. Right? I would basically give it simple instructions of anytime I ask questions, you're responding from the context of this strategy for the business.
Where does it go against it? Which questions would you ask?
Right. So it, the more context you give it, which is more to my point is you can't be lazy with AI. Like, that's where you're going to get bullshit answers. I mean, I don't know if you remember when they released GPT4, there was like a thing in the nerd world that they asked it, how many Rs are in the word strawberry?
And it would tell you two, right? And like, you sure? And it's like, yes. And it would say two. And then you would capitalize the R's and it's like, ah, you're right.
And you're like, bro, this thing can do, like, compute faster than anything, but it can't count ours in strawberry. That's the type of crap, you know, that if business owners see it, they're like, I can't trust that. It's like, okay, no, like, contextually, you give it more information about the business. Tell it what role it's playing.
Now you have your own, I say, consultant that knows everything about your business and is going to question on everything. And if you feed it more numbers, week over week, where are we moving in the right direction? Where are we not moving? Where are we backsliding? You know, to where we're not moving in the right direction at all. And it can do it in seconds. Right.
Anywhere else. Any of your business owners, I mean, that takes weeks, you know, days at least for consultants to respond back with questions. And now you're getting.
[00:58:07] Speaker A: And it's not tied to the whole. So it's like it's a exponential.
[00:58:14] Speaker A: Building of the ladder on the wrong wall.
[00:58:16] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:58:17] Speaker A: It's like you're. You're exponentially going faster the wrong direction. But like, to, to. To piggyback off what you're saying about the strawberry thing, you know, because my wife, she is like, oh, my God, she is so perfect for me, Tyler, because she doesn't believe anything.
So every time I say something, she's like, tell me. Prove it. And so I'm always having to prove whatever the F it is I'm saying to my wife. And so she's like, you don't have AI pushing back against you, which is a problem for you, Ryan. And I was like, to your point? Nodding. Not. Yeah, nodding your head. So here's here, here's how I responded to her. And I think this is so valid to everybody listening in that owns a company is.
I was watching Peter Diamantes and say it. What's his. His on the moonshots embolden the bun. Have you ever Watched Moonshots, the podcast. It's fantastic for anybody listening, anyone that wants.
It's insane. But they said, how do the power users of AI know when it's right or wrong? It's because you actually know whether it's right or wrong. Like I know based on math and accounting and like, like it's wrong. So like I can actually see. But like. So here's where I'm going with this Tyler is like I know what's right or wrong, whether it actually because, because at the end of the day at, with that 30 to $50 million and then like the 3 to 5 million in normalized EBITDA, the 10% working capital and we will have $18 million in cash.
All of that is a yes or no question based on math.
So like we, like then the how we get there is wildly open.
And so what I am hoping out of my material, which is why I'm super pumped to continue collaborating with you, is I want my independence by design, ownership, operating system to be like a 350 page super prompt for people to say here you go. You no longer have to understand all this stuff because it's putting all the constraints in.
So that way we can know we're actually working with the confines of the reality instead of GPT making up that we can fly to, you know, fly on our trike to Florida or something like that. So I'm hoping that all that context and then allows people like you to set free to say now we have our sandbox dude. We know what our constraints are, we know what our goals are, we know what is an objective truth.
Now there, there's like, that's where like the how, what tools do we use? How do we use them? How do we use them on, you know, daily, weekly operational things. Like what are some of the things that you're seeing? Like if we're doing all this work, what's the low hanging fruit in different operations, different like execution. Like I mean you, you, I know you like have got even like the technical, like you're building out GPTs. What are the tools? So that's kind of the bridge to. Okay, I'm hoping that this, you know, collaboration could help the masses.
[01:01:13] Speaker B: Yeah. So I would tell you one thing is everything you just described is from a computing data analyst perspective.
Right. And we've kind of been talking about that.
People forget that there's things that I don't understand from a development. I mean I have no development background, right? No technical.
The first time I used, you know, chat, GBT and anthropics. Claude, for coding, it was guiding me. I'm telling it step by step, guide me and say, okay, paste this into your terminal. And it took me 30 minutes to figure out, what the hell is a terminal? Like, no clue all the way to now. I mean, just with the evolution of it and using it, that's the other thing. Getting in there and figuring out, how do you do this? I mean, now I can build, I say, pretty much whatever, right? But the other part of that is from a, you know, analyst data, financial analyst perspective, it's giving you, because you're getting at the data, so it's having to compute it, right?
You can also ask it to explain to you, right? Hey, what does this mean? What are you actually seeing? Explain it to me like, I'm a fifth grader. I do this a lot for certain things. And then when I get it, I'm like, okay, now explain it. Like, I'm a freshman in college and I build my understanding back to that.
[01:02:37] Speaker B: The other thing is that most of these models have the thinking or the reasoning, right? Models that from a hypothetical perspective. And you and I talk briefly about this, but just as it gives you the insights, right? Hey, here's last week's data. Basically, compare it against our strategy.
[01:02:57] Speaker B: It's basically, you could tell it, think through what are some, you know, bottlenecks that could occur. What should we be preparing for? Why, like, where do you, where are you getting that from?
But all the depth that you can go to understand this stuff is now next level. Like, there's, there's no excuse, like when people are like, yeah, but I don't really. There's literally no excuse anymore. So again, like you said, just blindly trusting what it's telling you the first time. Look, still to this day, if I get any of the models to compute anything when it's done, like double check your work.
[01:03:35] Speaker A: And then do you check it against a different AI, a different model?
[01:03:38] Speaker B: Yeah, 100%. And that's for like what we're talking about. This is like real numbers, real, like I want to make sure and have it. You pin them against each other and let them figure out what it is. But the lowest hanging fruit is Claude, you know, Anthropic Squad, because they have what's called projects, right? In ChatGPT, it has projects.
But anything you add to the quote unquote, you know, project knowledge base isn't getting read by the model. It's just a holding place in ChatGPT for you to take those and then put them into the chat when you need them. That's not how Clauds works. Claude will ingest whatever, you know, files it can be Excel, PDF, whatever, it ingests, all of it. And then when you basically ask your question, it's using all of that to answer your question.
[01:04:33] Speaker A: Yeah. And so let's. We're now gonna get geeky here. So we're recording this on Monday, November 24, Friday, Gemini 3.0 came out. And I have not touched Gemini because I thought when they first came out and how much bullshit was coming out of the delusion of AI, I don't need to touch that. And I've been using. I've been just like pretty much all in on GPT, the team's version, the 60, $60 a month. I've got the projects. And so that way, to your point, like, I even, I even. I was asking GPT what's the best way to use you. And I even realized the projects to your point, like, you're having to constantly add documents. And that's why, like, I Tyler, I've been creating like a 300 page document, so I'm just constantly adding the entire operating system and saying, now I've got this question.
So I've been all in on GPT because I don't do any coding specifically for myself. Well, Gemini 3.0 came out on Friday and I watched. I was seeing like Banoff from Salesforce and then Mark Andreessen and like the Moon chats, people going like, whoa. And so like, I'm about to jump into it because what you just said, it now has the ability with your works, your Google workspace to ingest all of your documents and all of the web without all of the crazy delusion. So I don't know, I'm pretty pumped about what might come.
[01:05:53] Speaker B: Well, you can do that currently, but 3.0 is a significant upgrade. Like, I haven't dove into it.
I mean, obviously it came out.
[01:06:03] Speaker A: Yeah, two or three days I've.
[01:06:06] Speaker B: I've looked at some of the, you know, as far as the image creation, you know, and then how it integrates inside of, you know, anybody that works with Google Sheets, you know, Excel that's going to become like, you don't need to be an Excel wizard at all. Right.
But 3.0 has OpenAI.
But I mean, I read an article this morning. It's like, now OpenAI on the defense. Like, they.
[01:06:32] Speaker A: I'm not a Sam Altman fan, so, like, I'm more power to, to anybody else that can come up with the model. Yeah.
[01:06:41] Speaker B: And look, the reason I use flawed so much is because it's the coding powerhouse, right? So most of the integrations and stuff and computing data analysts, I mean I'm leveraging that before I do chatgpt, you know, but so let's talk about some of these.
[01:06:57] Speaker A: Let's, let's talk about what you're seeing on how people can be using it. Because anybody listening in for like every business owner that I, I work with, Tyler, they own their company, they can do whatever they want. So they're not going. It's not like they don't have like red tape. And so like they're using it for like everything that they can.
But there's always the question of how do I roll this out security wise with my different employees?
Because also like there is the desire for my clients in my community to use it with their employees and have their employees use it without risking the company. So that's kind of like maybe rolling it out company wide. But then let's talk about function and like are you using it in like call centers? Is it job ticketing? Is it like reviews, legal hr? I mean like what? So maybe kind of like.
[01:07:45] Speaker B: I'll tell you how I do every single project. If I haven't built something or integrated something similar in the past, I ask the model, right? So I give context of what am I currently trying to do, what is the process currently, who's involved, how are we doing it? Then you ask the question, how would I leverage AI to do what? What are you trying to do? Is it you trying to be more effective? You're trying to save time, like remove human error, what is it? Right. And at that point it'll break down or ask you questions and then you figure out what is the least technical, you know, non development heavy way to go about this and still it'll give me several options. Right? And then now again you have to, to build certain web apps and stuff like that. Yeah. You have to know which tools to use and how to host these.
[01:08:42] Speaker A: Then you just go and ask it again, right?
[01:08:45] Speaker B: Always. I mean, but that's what I'm telling you now.
[01:08:47] Speaker A: I know, I know.
[01:08:48] Speaker B: So like, okay, but, but what I will tell you is that don't think of it as like you just said, how would our company use it or all the different employees use it from, you know, we're worried about from a security perspective. Now I will tell you both of these models, like I know for sure. Claude and chatgpt both have this little toggle for data Right. Like do not whatever improve the models with my, you know, information.
Now I know we all trust the government on this podcast, but you know, that's one way. But that means you're adding stuff to the chat. Right. But if what we've been talking about is like you're asking these questions. Okay, here's my financial strategy. Let me ask these questions. When you start building either automations or you know, you're building your own agent, like that's not the same thing as putting it into ChatGPT. What you're doing is bringing your stuff and putting it into their realm. Right. That's where most people are scared from a security perspective. But all of These models have APIs that you can tap into. So whatever you build for your company, if you actually, like we've talked about, either you need AI to do it or you need AI to build it.
Most of the stuff that I do, I use AI to build it. I don't, they don't actually use AI in the actual workflow.
Right. But these are all, these are low hanging fruit automations that like you said, if you're trying to scale the company or you know, 3x the company over however long. Okay, well you do that faster if you're not paying more in salaries, overhead.
[01:10:27] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, I'm tracking.
[01:10:29] Speaker B: Yeah. Where are you removing that? You know, and that's the lowest. Hanging fruit is always administrative, you know, back office type things like what do you, you said call centers. I've, I've done some of that. But at scale, that's. I mean nowadays they have different SaaS offerings that, it makes it really easy. You're not building that shit from scratch.
[01:10:50] Speaker A: It's, it's like it's anything that you don't like doing.
[01:10:53] Speaker B: Yes, yes.
[01:10:55] Speaker A: I mean, because it's analyzing service tickets, analyzing project management, you know, budget to actual analyzing sales reports. I mean it's just like. Or creating them or like it. Like.
[01:11:08] Speaker A: So you're, you're. Before I go on to. I got another idea. I want to talk to you about the. So you're.
[01:11:15] Speaker A: Taking the issue or constraint at hand, using AI to build APIs and building tools. So that way you're just taking that constraint out and it could be anything but you're so there. It's more the tool functionality that you're talking about.
[01:11:32] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean again.
[01:11:35] Speaker B: I use Claude and chat GBT pretty much all day, you know, and what I'm doing but for planning and like strategy of, of what you're trying to do. I mean like I Just said they're all connected to the Internet, so you can get to, you know, an agreement of this is what we're going to build and then use that same plan in a new chat and ask the question, who else has already done this? How are they doing it? What's different? Like, where are my risks? Like, you can ask all these questions and it'll give you the context. But the main thing is, like you said, what's the lowest hanging fruit? And I would tell you still to this day is with Claude's projects, because giving it all the context and look, you can do this now, but you're having to build your own database. Right? You have to vectorize this database. Some of the software is actually do it. And when they vectorize it, they're just turning all the words into like numbers, sequences to where the model can connect dots. Right. And so like you said, if you need to respond a certain way, let's say it's a, I don't know, a customer service chatbot. That's what you would do. Right? But how do you do that to where it's the most effective? You're not going to go build something and then just iterate on it. But you could use projects for anything that we've talked about. You upload the files and ask your questions. Like, that's where I see most people not leveraging this at all. And they're like, yeah, I uploaded some files and asked a question. I'm like, no, no, upload the files and ask different chats all the context. And now they both have memory. They have. I mean, dude, it's. I mean, we talk about AI evolving fast when you're in it.
And, oh, I finally built whatever that I can do this. And then, I mean, I just saw it. Claude just implemented. I don't even see the release for it. I don't even know if they released it. Is that it? It compresses your chat. So it used to be you'd run out of chat length. Right now it'll compress the chat and I'm like, when?
[01:13:36] Speaker A: So you can keep the memory going.
[01:13:38] Speaker B: Yeah. This has been a pain in my ass for an entire year.
[01:13:41] Speaker A: You know, you be doing with GPT, I would copy and paste the entire chat, which ended up being like 700 pages. Put that in my Obsidian text file and then I would start a new chat. So I'd have like seven 700 page documents in MD files that I was uploading. And it was just like, so that way it could keep the thing going. Let me.
So I'll give you a use case of like. Because before I get into this, because I'll tell example how I've been using it and I'm curious on like some of your thoughts, but what's wild, Tyler is like.
[01:14:17] Speaker A: When I came out and every day I have lit like, it was like, I use it all day, every day for everything.
And like, I just find it fascinating.
[01:14:31] Speaker A: It's like this, it's really a mindset because, like, you know, you and I can rip off these questions in your thoughts and. And then I'll. Because I'll get into my use case because my dad and I are in this new venture together with some other people and he's just like, I mean, he's known me my whole life and he's like, what in the are you doing? He gets it and he's just like, he sent me over, he's using it and then he sends me over his garbage and then I rally back and it's like everything to do with how you're thinking and, and it's just, it's just so fascinating to me.
Like, have you dove into or done any reflecting of like, what type of personalities or mindsets or what is allowing people like you and I to, to like hit the ground running like Wild E. Coyote while other people are like, not sure what to do?
[01:15:27] Speaker B: I mean, one thing in that regard is I feel like most people are waiting for it to get easier to use, right? I mean, just like a computer having kids. You know, you watch some of these three year olds or whatever, they operate a phone better than your parents. You know, they can't even string together sentences and they're operating this phone, it's because they just used it and learned. And that's how it works with us as well, you know, so it's a.
I don't know. I. I was. If I look back, I mean, just like this podcast, you go back and listen to your first episode, everybody that does this is like, oh my God, it's painful.
[01:16:09] Speaker A: It took me two weeks to record a 15 minute interview that was with myself.
[01:16:13] Speaker B: Yeah, it's painful, right? And you do it more and you learn and that's how I would tell you.
Even just listening to how. Or people will share their chats and like the first prompt, when I see what they were trying to do, I'm like, nope. You know, look, I don't write any of my own prompts. Like, if I have something significant I'm doing, I explained it in one chat and then at the end of that chat, I say, take this whole conversation and turn it into, like, an effective prompt to whatever. Let the robots talk to the robots. Like, why are you trying to, you know, everybody's like, oh, a natural language. Yeah, but they have to interpret natural language. Let this one speak in beeps and boots, you know, to the other one. And simple. I mean, it works.
Yeah.
[01:17:05] Speaker A: And what I've been doing on that, maybe for a practical takeaway for people, too, is I create core documents. So, like, I have a strategic planning document that I sent you.
And so, like, here's my strategic planning document. I have an ideal client profile document. I have, you know, the financial forecast document. I like. So, like, every part of these functional areas, like, like, once you get one of these, these core documents, then you're going, okay, here's all the context. And that's why I want my operating system, the ownership operating system, to be like that core umbrella. So then you can ask one question inside of it. To take.
[01:17:42] Speaker A: A lot of another friend I think you and I talked about, it's like, instead of these prompts, I think that's the problem with a lot of people that I've seen is the prompts is just a question. And I got all like. Even, like, people go prompt engineer. I'm like, that's just a silly word. It's like, wait, you're just, you're just a person asking questions and you're calling that prompts. Like, it's just like, be a human. And so it is challenging for a lot of people. So I, I think what, what I am trying to do is allow people to not have to be unnatural, because I think it is so unnatural for a lot of people. Where, like, I go back to school and the, the first part of this podcast, we're like, why? Why, why, why? Why? Why? Why? Why? Why? Why, why, why, why, why? That's like, that's me. And, like, most people are not like that. So then it's like, if we can flip the dynamic and then, like, say, here's the context of everything, and then the. The AI can actually prompt the human, I think when that happens, but the reality is, like, when that happens, and that's what I'm trying to do. And I think you and I are trying to collaborate to figure out how we can do that for people, because that's when I think the acceleration of the goals and progress will happen for people, because you're taking the obscure, infinite amount of choices away from the person, because it's really infinite. You can do whatever you want, but we have to come up with the constraints and. And GPT can't, or Anthropic or Gemini can't come up with our own goals. It is your job to come up with your goals. And that's the whole point about being a human. Right?
[01:19:18] Speaker B: But you can, even if you're stuck, right? That's one of my biggest things is even if you're stuck, you absolutely can have IT question you. And if you tell it, you are a business goal and strategy expert, right?
[01:19:33] Speaker A: And I want to know what all the constraints are.
[01:19:36] Speaker B: What questions would you ask me? Give it whatever context about your business. What questions would you ask me so that we can come to like, you know, feasible growth goals, financial strategy, whatever it may be.
And it will 100%. I mean, I talk to, you know, most people that know me. Like, I see all those memes on Instagram. It's like, hey, you get 3 million if the next person you call doesn't answer. Who you calling? I get tagged in stuff like that all the time. It's because I see it. I'm like, but I'm not, I'm not talking on the phone unless I'm in the car or I hate it. Like, I'm. I definitely would prefer to work and talk with robots, but chatgpt with the voice mode, like, I use that more than anything. Like it used to be, you know, listen to podcasts in the car. Now if I have certain questions, certain things that pop up during the day, I have a list that I will literally get in the car.
And now I'm asking, going back and forth, and you get to keep all these chats. So it's the same thing from a. Let's say you give some level of. You have an example financial strategy, hey, based on this, like, ask me some questions about my business, whatever it may be, to where at the end of the chat we have my own sound financial strategy. Are you going to just get this beautiful, you know, document, check the box and you're done? No, not in one chat.
[01:20:59] Speaker A: But refine, refine, refine.
[01:21:01] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, you don't have anyone else in your pocket that is going to ask the level of questions, the depth, have all the context that we talked about.
Like, we've never had this and that's what people like. Well, I just, I don't know. I'm not that type. I don't think that way. You don't have to, like, you don't have to think this way.
[01:21:18] Speaker A: Just start, just start. Right?
[01:21:20] Speaker B: But I Mean like I said, given the context, like we used to ask other humans and stuff and they would either have to remember it and they could reference it and then they would answer you. It is a full context that you're not asking questions.
[01:21:34] Speaker A: And I think as I, as I started doing that too or just jumping in and I think you and I are about down near the same age. I think there's our generation or so. I was born in 86 and like.
[01:21:47] Speaker B: I mean I grew up 87.
[01:21:48] Speaker A: Yeah, I grew up where like dude, I was riding to my neighbor's house with a shotgun over my, over, over my bike. So like there was no Internet, there was no phones until I was like in high school. And I got, we got our first, you know, household compact and then I got my next to walkie talkie when I got my, got my license.
And then so like I was at this weird age where like when all that all this shit started coming out, I was like, you can't break it. So there was like I was mature and old enough to know like how to tinker around with all this stuff. And then also like, like you couldn't mess up Napster. You couldn't mess up I aim. You know what I mean? Like you. So yeah, maybe I burnt. I had burned all my CDs and then I'd put the. Oh my God dude, I'd put the, the COVID art. Like I had a cover art maker. So I'd pretend it was non explicit music and then I was burning explicit.
Anyways, I digress. The, the point is, is realizing that you can't break it. And so having that and, and what I think is like if people just start and realizing you can't break it. What I think compounds on top of each other is the more I use it, you'll like, I run in. You know, I quickly started running into roadblocks going, I wish it had more context. I wish it had more context. So then it becomes better data management, better file organization, better clarity of thoughts. And so like it just compounds on top of each other. It's like I went through and I said okay, I have a lot of thoughts because I consume economic and monetary shit. Like it's my week weakness because I love it so much. It's like, well I. And I'm constantly asking questions like this. Well then it was like, okay, I go through every single YouTube channel or so that Tyler, I will literally grab every single YouTube transcript because you can go down to the show notes say show more. You can copy the transcript and then it's like all of it. So it could be my economic theory, AI bot or the same thing I did with. I, I did it with my health. So last week, dude.
So I have now five years of blood work from my doctor. I don't know what any of it means. You probably do. I don't know. It's all like, it's all in the green except a couple in there in the yellow. Apparently I work out too much is what I've been told by, by AI. So like it was like the interpretation of it.
And so I said, and I sent you my, my, my lab or my, my routine and the, the analysis. And it was like. And so I just got my new blood work last week and it was like it engineered a supplement stack my routine because like, here's the goal. And it, like, it, it.
[01:24:17] Speaker B: It.
[01:24:17] Speaker A: Because I can stop talking. My point is, is like, it was just the more and more I use it, the more and more I want it to know everything. So the more data gathering and clean data and, and the clarity of the prompts becomes. So I think people can work out and expand without having to conquer the whole world to begin with.
[01:24:35] Speaker B: Well, and not become, I say, an expert. Like the. Usually when I talk to people about building workflows, you know, or automations or, you know, custom web apps, whatever, it's like, oh, yeah, I saw the software that you can type in in natural language and it'll build it. And I'm like, it does, but it ain't that easy, you know, like once you start getting more sophisticated for like a business where what is the database? Like, what are the different APIs you have to connect and use? Does it look good and look real? Yeah, I've built some prototypes within minutes, you know, with AI, try and use it. It's garbage, you know, like, it, it doesn't work right.
And one of the things that has come up, you know, however long I've been doing this, you know, the past two years, is that it's not necessarily, hey, get someone like, like me to come build whatever for your business.
[01:25:31] Speaker B: What has come up is basically, could you show us how we would do it right? And the value of that is, who do you have in your organization that is, you know, not conventional. I say it especially if it's a bigger company, because good luck with that. Like, you run into all kind of red tape and, you know, bureaucracy, but someone who could learn this and then you show them one aspect, like, that's the majority of what I've done. Is like, look, I'm not saying you're going rebuild your ERP system or something huge like, don't waste your time, you don't need to.
But there are certain things, you know, every. I say every. Most of the businesses I've worked with, it's, oh, our, you know, admin has to take 6, 8 hours a month doing this and they show it to me and then I show them, okay, I would just do this, this and this. You're talking, you're taking six to eight hours a month and you can do it within seconds. Like once, once that automation is built. So it's not, hey, you're going to learn AI and build this one thing that's just going to have you, you know, sip and monetize on the beach somewhere and your business is just operating. That's not the way it works.
But it usually takes these business owners to see one thing they haven't seen. Like you and I using it all the time. We know not to do certain things because it's not going to work or just things we take for granted. Right. And once you show them that, I mean, I've yet to work with a business owner that once they see the first one, they're like.
[01:27:06] Speaker B: That is the insight. Because you could, I could build these, you know, presentations and show people all this stuff. And it's the one thing selfishly and personally they see, they're like, put it. And that next question is the direction usually it goes, you know, so it's not again, them using it, using the chats and stuff like we are. Yeah, that just, that's like an acquired skill, you know, how to do it efficiently. But as far as for the business like it, it doesn't take much to look to see where are we wasting time.
[01:27:35] Speaker A: And that's just a start. I mean, you're starting and you're building that habit, building the reps. I mean it's just like all the habits that you probably help people with over, over the years with health, you know, you just start slowly. You're not, you're not running an Ironman tomorrow. I loved your analogy of it's like a downward stock, you know, and it's, it's, it, it is compounding and it's compounding up the right direction, but it's not immediate and you don't have to think it is.
[01:27:58] Speaker B: Well, and it doesn't take, you know, I say with AI, you know, it, it doesn't take that long to where now the culture becomes. It's to get started it's this huge uphill battle. Right. And then once you get started, it's not, you know, oh, this actually is easier. You start getting frustrated with certain things that, well, can't we just build something to like, that's the companies I've worked with, you know, more than three months. It's the lens that they start looking through is how would we build something to where it could, like, could it grab this data to. Yes, right. Most of the time it's like, yes, it can. And what would that need to look like? And then you start building these workflows, you know, in like N8N or any of these open workflows. Well, it can pull data from wherever it can.
[01:28:46] Speaker A: This is why we're going to get you involved to figure out how do we build the financial model, how do I systemize my coaching? Because this is going to be so fun again.
[01:28:54] Speaker B: And that's what I'm saying. It's, it's piece by piece for something that's complex. Right? But most things in business together, the organism is complex. Right. And mainly because you're dealing with the culture, you're having to deal with humans. AI doesn't have emotions. Like, it doesn't, we talked about this. You can yell at it, get pissed off and it's like a dog, you know, like they still want. It's like, hey, you know, let me come love up on you.
[01:29:18] Speaker A: You're right, I was wrong.
[01:29:21] Speaker B: I mean it's, but again it's, it's the biggest barrier that I see is anytime I'll ask, hey, what have you tried using AI for?
They tell me this very complex, you know, as they're talking, I mean, I know because I've seen it and built them and I'm like, okay, that's a database. Okay, that's one query. Okay, that. And I'm thinking through and they're like, yeah. And I plugged it into chat GPT. I'm like, like you hear the record screech. You're like, okay, that's, you're, you're, you're going way too overboard. Like what are the low hanging fruit? You just went to the top of the tree like, what is the low hanging fruit here in the business? And again they start thinking, oh, this is going to take so long to. And it doesn't. Because I don't know your business. I don't know, like you said, I don't know your goals, I don't know the problems you're technically having. Right. But once you show them, one always Whoever is the decision maker, it doesn't have to be the CEO, whatever.
[01:30:17] Speaker A: They always have story. What's your favorite? Like.
[01:30:23] Speaker B: I don't know. I'd have to think on that.
[01:30:27] Speaker B: I'm trying to think with several of the.
[01:30:30] Speaker A: For someone's just like, whoa.
[01:30:34] Speaker B: I mean, one.
[01:30:37] Speaker B: I had one guy that had a.
He was like a wine distributor, right? And he was wanting to know if originally, if we could, some of their inventory numbers and margins. You know, they have to pull it from their ERP system. And it's like, go filter here, download this file, filter here, download this file. And then he had his admin rebuilding using the data, filling in, double checking the margins, all this stuff. So as he's talking about it, it's like, okay, I'm thinking of all the technical side of how to build it.
And when he saw the original, hey, we take the files, this data becomes a rubric. He had asked the question. He's like, hey, at the end of the month, we have to basically pull for every vendor, right? All of the different tastings we've done, the percentage of the discounts, the amounts, because they get reimbursed depending on their agreement. It could be 50%. It could be 100% of any of the tastings, right? Well, it adds up, like, per month, it was anywhere between like 15 and like 35k, right? And they were manually having to go through it. And so building that, it was taking his admin, I think it was around 10 to 12 hours a month to do it.
And within a couple weeks, I built it. And it'll do it. I mean, it does it in like two seconds, you know, because it's all coded, right? It's not AI Again, I used AI to code it, but the code is just the code. It doesn't hallucinate, you know, it doesn't veer off. It is what it is. It pulls these numbers, it calculates whatever, and then it gives you the exact report that she would have to like, upload and send out, you know, so again, it's. I would have never gone in there and been like, what's your end of the month? You know, vendor reporting? Like, I don't know any of this. Like, I don't know shit about that business, but show me what you're currently doing. And now I'd say I have a lens for being like, oh, yeah, we could definitely do that. How long is that taking? You know, what's the issue? But I mean, it. Again, it's.
You're not going to get me to come into your business and just go like, oh, light bulb. We should build something. It. It hasn't worked that way yet.
[01:32:53] Speaker A: Yeah, right. Well, and that's where I, I'm very excited to continue our discussions, collaborating and even talking to like, Jeff west, because I think we, we triangulate a lot of these things and then you can start setting you loose like freaking cannonball. Just whack a mole and all these different things. And it could be fascinating.
[01:33:11] Speaker B: I mean, look, the, the biggest thing that I would say, even for your listeners is, you know, Claude released whatever, like three weeks ago, what's called skills, right? Well, essentially what it is is you show it inside of one of the chats, what you're trying to do, right? Hey, here's the. Let's just say, like, we're talking about the financial reporting. This is what we're downloading from QuickBooks.
This is the dashboard that my admin is using to build, right? It's using the exported files to build it. If you import that and show it the beginning and the end, and then explain basically what the person's doing, the easiest way to do this is just have them record themselves talking through what they're doing and give it the transcript.
Then test it, right, with another month of data. And it teaches itself how to do it, writes its own instructions for it, and then gives you a zip file that you upload into Claude as a skill. So every time you want to do that, you would just give the input files and say, I.
I'm pretty sure.
[01:34:19] Speaker A: That'S exactly how my friend and old business partner Pat Hobby, who is, built out this financial model that I was showing you.
And we can export the trial balance of an accounting system, which is usually messy as shit. And then you have to clean up the data to then drop it into the spreadsheet. And then you assign rollup codes. Tyler. So, like, effectively, if the. I mean, I've got people where it's like 55 revenue lines. It's like you need five and then. But you need to clean up all the data. Well, he sends me this text over and he's like, holy shit. He goes, I cleaned up all of. And it was one of my clients from 2011 to now.
Every one of their monthly trial balances was cleaned up in an hour.
[01:35:03] Speaker B: It was just.
[01:35:04] Speaker A: He was like, holy shit. Because what I want to do is I want to help people get this financial model part of my 90 day onboarding, or my 90 day boardroom blueprint. And which is the onboarding, like, here's an entire. Here's your goals, here's your financial model, here's your business valuation. Here's all of this in three months you'll have all of that plus the training.
And it's been like this has been hurdles and it's like to your point, as long as you can just explain what you're doing, it's fascinating.
[01:35:31] Speaker B: Yeah once it sees it, that's what I'm saying that you think through all the different things that you or your team members are doing repetitively. Daily, weekly, monthly, doesn't matter anything repetitive. I'd be looking for ways like what's the easiest low hanging fruit to automate this?
[01:35:47] Speaker A: What the last question is, where do you see some of the trends going over the next couple years?
[01:35:54] Speaker B: I mean I'll start off with any mention of AGI.
You know, just true agentic AI is.
[01:36:03] Speaker B: At least it's months if not years away. So if that's what business owners are waiting on to where oh they're going to build something that I can just tell it whatever, don't wait. Like I'd be. I always explain.
[01:36:17] Speaker A: I mean there's not almost, not even Elon today maybe said something with, with his whole Tesla with and the Optimus and all the nodes but like I mean I don't even see a path to it unless it is all the nodes of his Tesla ecosystem. But I don't even know man.
[01:36:34] Speaker B: Yeah but that's very specific right? Like for driving, like. But as far as in business, like if you're just waiting for somebody to put out a model that is going to do everything we're talking about with no context or can't right now. I mean that's why you haven't seen it. It's been what I mean ever since last year they were talking about oh we think they're going to have true agents in and again all these forums I'll follow true like I say, dark web hacker, programmers, developers are like no, like none of this, all of it's hype. Right. So I mean where I even fascinate.
[01:37:11] Speaker A: Like when you and I were talking about it last week, even if AGI was out tomorrow, which I'm technically talking to one right now. Right. You are a conscious being and you still have to ask me Ryan, what are your goal?
[01:37:27] Speaker B: Yeah, there's still context. It still requires context and look where it's going. It's just it all the features of it are getting better like I just said. Yeah, the memory, they didn't have that right. It was new Context, how it breaks up the information. All of that stuff is getting better, but as far as it making just leaps and bounds light year, you know, that's slowing down. Like just the. I mean the image models and stuff are really cool and it's super frustrating on social media, you know, is this AI like that's aggravating, you know, but it's, it's still funny and cool. But as far as for business and computing and I'm still shocked at going into businesses and seeing some of the stuff that.
[01:38:15] Speaker A: That's why I think AI. AI could be in a bubble because you go, holy shit, it is like it. Yeah, it'd be, it's interesting.
[01:38:23] Speaker B: I mean like you said, if people are, you know, scared to use it or making whatever excuses, all they have to do is play. I mean, again, the lowest hanging fruit is anthropics. You know, clog projects just because of the context and you start learning pretty quick. And look, you've heard me talk about this. If you go to any of the reasoning models and you ask a question, hypothetically, whatever you want it to think through all these different issues, whatever it may be, what it spits out, you know, I say 75%, usually it's less than that. 75% of it is probably not very useful. But that 25 or 10 it asks one question or give. It may give one insight that even for me, like consulting.
Yes. It's like, oh, and then you'll ask them the, you know, the owner of the question. They're like, I've never thought of that. Right. I didn't think of it. You know what I mean? Like again, like you can.
The under utilization is probably the biggest detriment. Just.
Yeah, you don't have to build all this complex shit. It's just figuring out what's one thing like challenge anybody in the company. What's one thing, you know, you could leverage AI for. And that's the other context is that a lot of employees don't want to introduce it because they'll be out of a job security.
[01:39:43] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:39:44] Speaker B: That's their fear. So they, they stifle it, which is.
[01:39:47] Speaker A: I think it's the first time ever. And, and I think the way that people listening in can overcome that is if someone has a clearer goal, 30 to 50 million bucks over the next four years, we can do that while holding our margins and increasing pay.
You know what I mean? Like, so that's a way to like describe it. Say instead of, you know, adding bodies for all this stuff, like we can make the pie bigger for everybody that already works here and continue to grow. So like there's a way to.
[01:40:13] Speaker B: And you don't have to think through that. What would that pie, how would it grow? How would we split this up? Like you can put that into a model. You don't have to take it, whatever it gives you, but it's going to give you insights. That. And look, all these business owners, their, their bandwidth is, at the end of the day, done. All the decisions they're making, it's like, how do you just make less decisions? And that would be the start. Like just get a taste of it, you know, and then I like that, I like that. Now you start backing up, going, oh, I could do this and I could do this.
If you don't need to be, you know, in the mix. You have some of these guys that they need to be needed.
They say they want to, they want to step out and not operate their business, but they're addicted to it. So that's the other.
[01:40:58] Speaker A: Yeah, hopefully people listening is like my favorite, my favorite statement is I want no one to need me. I want people to want me.
[01:41:04] Speaker B: That's it.
[01:41:05] Speaker A: Tyler, where can people find you, man?
[01:41:08] Speaker B: Well, I'm not a big social media.
[01:41:11] Speaker A: You're not a tick tocker? Come on, man. You just seem like.
[01:41:14] Speaker B: No, I use Instagram just for the, the humor, whatever's funny. So I mean I'm, I'm an email guy, so. At Tilafleur Phi Life is where you can reach me most readily. Ask whatever questions, insights, whatever, that's where you're going to get me.
[01:41:32] Speaker A: Thanks, brother, for coming on and spending the time with me. Appreciate it.
[01:41:35] Speaker B: For sure. Thank you.
