Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Welcome to the Independence by Design podcast where we discuss what it means to be a business owner and ways to get unstuck from the day to day so we can design a business that gives us a life of independence.
All right, Kim, so we are kicking off the predictable revenue module and we're going to have a couple episodes around predictable revenue. What that is, we've got strategic planning, we've got the user journey, and then we got data and systems. I think the order is fantastic. You and I have worked on this for the last couple years, well, about 18 months now. We've done some podcasts about these topics already. And I think what we can do for everybody listening in is we can put those links below. So they wanted to go putz around and like, you know, get different versions of this topic. But what we're trying to do, I think in this episode is just neatly package it together with a complete idea, like, what is predictable revenue? What are your and I's different versions and different thoughts about what strategic planning looks like. And one thing that I would be interested to hear your thoughts on too is like, how people can start using AI to enhance their thinking about what strategic planning is. Because I think that's one of the.
One of the biggest opportunities for people is like the $50,000 consultant workbook could still be a great option for people. But I think we have more opportunities now if we understand different tools and exercises and concepts that are pretty well known, how to use those as part of our actual, you know, actual doing. But should we start with like, what do you. What's your definition of predictable revenue and why did you like that phrase?
[00:01:42] Speaker B: Sure. And I agree with the AI statement fully, especially with our community and the IBD clients and stuff, having all of their information built out there and then being able just to relate back to the predictable revenue module that we have. I'm doing that as a mid year update with all of my clients and it's certainly just mind blowing to them. They're like the level of detail, accuracy, guidance, and they're rolling it out to all their team members for unity throughout the company and stuff like that. So I hold it.
[00:02:11] Speaker A: What do you mean? Just to stop there. So because you have these artifacts all over the place because you've built them out, allowing you to like pull on them, Is that what you mean?
[00:02:21] Speaker B: Yeah. And conversations that are had, like for example, this podcast and when you have a transcript, people are just recording themselves and they're building their version of themselves in AI. So that way when they say okay. Kim says I need to work on a winning position in a total addressable market. The machine knows everything about them because it's been being fed this information and it can help build all of those things.
[00:02:46] Speaker A: Love it. We're definitely going to go back to that.
[00:02:49] Speaker B: But yeah, let's go down a rabbit trail. A rabbit trail there. So my definition of predictable revenue is revenue that you can accurately predict.
It's in the words itself. I know I'm not supposed to use that as a definition, but that means
[00:03:03] Speaker A: we did a good job labeling them
[00:03:04] Speaker B: on pretty self explanatory.
And then why do I like the fact that we need a decks? It's clear. And that's the thing that everybody's trying to get to. When you're talking campaigns or sales forecasts or go to market strategies. It's all because you want to have revenue and you want to be able to predict when you're going to get said revenue. So that way you can plan the rest of the company around it.
[00:03:28] Speaker A: And I would suggest that people go check out the what does a good CRO do? Because you talk about the intersection of sales and marketing and just conceptually what a CRO does. But that's why we have the CRO function that is specific to revenue. Because when I, when I met you, what I like, what I resonated so much with is like okay, we have an income statement and we just need these numbers land in each column for each product and service line every month.
Because as we were saying yesterday in the group, the group workshop about annual budgeting, we was like 50% of the time or 50% of the effort is in the predictable revenue part of a budget because everything else falls out of that. Like it's way easier for ops to build, build things out confidently. Whether it's hiring people or buying machinery or you know, expanding a location, if they feel more confident in the revenue and if you don't feel confident in the revenue, then you're going to be hesitant and you're, they're going to miss opportunities and, or you're going to over invest and regret it. So yeah, I think it just, it just is so simple as we just want a high confidence rating that every single column for 12 months we hit, we hit the revenue numbers which really
[00:04:44] Speaker B: as we all, we both know is not an easy thing to get to. But I think the important part to highlight is that it is possible.
It just takes time because it is a system that needs to be built and put into place. And I think a lot of Owners just get antsy and don't like continuing to put in the time to build it the right way. So they get distracted with the new and the shiny or the new consultant that says, well, I can bring in 10x more sales. And it's not predictable revenue if you're always just chasing the next shiny new thing. That is you having to continuously think through the business and have to continuously try to hit that next influx of money coming in the door. Versus saying I have.
Yeah. And it's like, versus saying I have a system that's ongoing, it's methodical, it's compounding. It gets better and better over time and therefore it's reliable because it consistently gives the results as expected.
[00:05:43] Speaker A: So you. I know that the purpose of today's conversation is to talk about strategic planning and how that is the first milestone. But we also have the user journey and then the systems and governance and data we have. And I don't know if you want to put. Because you're the CRO, if you want to put the link to the predictable revenue assessment in the, in the link below or some of the CRO tools if you want to. But the point of me bringing that up is you want to give just a quick cliff note of why you chose these milestones and the order that you chose them in. Because there's a lot underneath all of this stuff. But there was a lot of thought about why we're starting with strategic planning and not CRM or not paid ads and cold calling.
[00:06:28] Speaker B: Yeah. And I think that's a.
An important part to mention because a lot of people do jump to either campaigns or sales strategy or the systems and such. So the first milestone is the revenue architecture. And I really liked how he landed on that word architecture, because without knowing the blueprints of the business, how do we know what are the best things to be building to support the business? Right. Like should I use a steel beam in this section of my blueprint or should I use a 2x4? Right. So you need that blueprint of the business to know what materials and everything that you need to build the rest of the system engine.
[00:07:13] Speaker A: Yep, yep.
So strategic planning, there's a lot of jargon around there. And then you have leaned towards the revenue architecture, strategic planning kind of being one concept.
What is your definition or what are the components of strategic planning in your mind? In your mind.
[00:07:32] Speaker B: That's a very loaded question because there's a lot of steps.
[00:07:35] Speaker A: Let's see how many consulting jargon words you can say at once.
Quant Analysis matrix, sop.
[00:07:45] Speaker B: Well, and so that's why the words to me matter, because strategic planning is so commonly used or so a lot of strategic. Strategic plan.
I thought through how I want to grow my business to $20 million five years from now. And my strategic plan is that I'm going to grow by X percent every single year. And we're just going to figure it out as we go how to make that happen.
I think that's a very common strategic plan, which is why I like the revenue architecture better, that blueprint concept, because that is how you want to design your business. So this is not, I'm looking out five years necessarily and saying this is the dollar amount. The revenue architecture step that we have is step one is building that blueprint. And so that, that really is like your, your position in the marketplace.
And people are like, well, I know how I'm positioned in the marketplace. I have XYZ competitive advantages. Right. And so it's just, it's peeling the onion through everything to truly get to the nitty gritty details of the business, of where you truly fit in the market and how your customers are viewing you. Your ideal customer profile.
Common question I ask people and they're like, I have these five ideal customer profiles. And it's like, well, no, you really just need like ideal is like best superlative. Like let's start, start with, with the one.
[00:09:11] Speaker A: I have nine first priorities.
[00:09:15] Speaker B: Exactly, exactly. So the revenue architecture is. I'd like to break it apart maybe from strategic planning, like word choice, just because they are two different things. When we get to the third section of systems and governance, that's when we have the forecasting that's in there. And I think that is much more in line with what people commonly think of strategic planning is that forecasting step.
[00:09:41] Speaker A: And just to put some more color behind some of this too is when you're saying forecasting, when we're talking about the CRM and data and governance in milestone, what would that be? 11, 12, 13? I think it would be no, 15. 15. Yep, yep. So the, that would like loop us Back to milestone 12, which is.
And 12 and 11 and 12, which is budgeting.
[00:10:06] Speaker B: Right.
[00:10:07] Speaker A: So we're kind of like, that's why this, the whole IBD is this loop de loop because we're constantly going back and we're enhancing, enhancing the flywheel. But we have to know what we're pointed towards with that forecast, with that budget.
So that way we can use the systems in the data, everything like that to point us somewhere. And you Know, one thing that I really loved came, it was, oh, my gosh, there was a podcast I was listening to like a year ago where they were like, that's where I learned about OODA loops.
Observe, orient, decide and act. And I might got the observe and decide or observe and orient different. But the whole point is we want to tighten up this feedback loop. But they talked about decision making, and decision making, by definition, is actually the elimination of all other choices but this one.
So when we talk about constraints of time, cash and wealth, we have to decide not to do a bunch of shit so we can do this thing to make progress.
And you and I just watched a podcast clip of Peter Diamante from Moonshots talking about waking up with a goal and a very clear goal so we can go get it and then we can then harness AI and all of our resources towards that goal. And that's what I'm hearing you talk about with a revenue architecture where we know who we're targeting, why we're targeting them, how we're going to mobilize our resources to go get those people, to make a message that resonates with those people with their pain and their all of those things. And there's a lot of, lot of variables in there, but at the end of the day, it's not the spray and pray, it's the sniper approach to your ideal client profile. So that way you can have that person convert through the stages, which is the user journey that we're going to be talking about next week. But I feel is what really resonates me with whether strategic planning or revenue architecture, just saying no to everything else. And it's the thought process of going through this blueprint, the revenue architecture, to be confident that you're not missing something. And maybe that's something that really resonates with me. It's just the confidence that you're not having FOMO of the other things you could be doing.
[00:12:10] Speaker B: Yeah. And that's really difficult for a lot of business owners to not have that fomo. That doesn't come easily. It's a really common trait to always chase shiny and new. That's a great way just to spin in circles and not make forward progress. And I've seen, I can't emphasize enough how important this stage is. I can give you a couple of client examples. I've had one client been working with for about a year, and they were so confident they understood their brand identity.
But for the next three and a half, four months of working with them, we just spun in circles. We could not nail down the true brand identity because what they thought was the nail down level.
I'd ask them questions and they'd realize, well actually we don't know the next level and we need the next level to have that sniper approach. And so it took like the three and a half, four months.
And then I would say probably so we use that as our architecture did. All the other steps moved to user journey. Started implementing different things for about a two month period in the user journey.
And I started looking at it, I'm like, something's broken, something's not working the way that we thought that things were going to work. So I dived into some of the information, this and that. Come to find out, I'm like, we have the complete wrong ideal customer profile. It doesn't match the psychology of the situation of the marketplace. Which was funny because the actual ICP was the one that I had discussed in the beginning and it was a hard no, that is not our ICP at all. That's not who we're targeting. And so what I uncovered was that there was a predetermined like narrative of ownership towards a certain audience. So they, they read data in a certain way to tell the story that they wanted it to tell.
And it wasn't until we went to market and we're executing that the results actually came back and told the owner, no, look at like you are wrong. And you can either continue down this path because this is what you desire, or you can meet the market where the market is and start seeing the results and benefits that you're looking for. So the process can be very lengthy, but it's very eye opening and then it reaps a lot of benefits from it from there. So that's customer number one, customer number two knew their icp, knew their brand identity, they were spot on. They got through the revenue architecture section within like a month or two, nailed it down and are already seeing the benefits from that. I think the importance was, is that owner number two was already had already gone through the exercise of being open and honest with themselves and so that they were more open minded to the data versus trying to dictate a story.
[00:15:00] Speaker A: Let's walk the audience through. Like what I'm trying to think about the best way to do this because I think it would be helpful for us to walk through the steps of building out that revenue architecture and that strategic plan. I'm just using both those words because I, I, I think they're both interchangeable and unless you want to completely decouple them and explain the, the difference of the two walking through, like, what are the components of that of it. But also asking, I don't know how to, how to start or how to ask the questions.
What questions do people need to be able to answer, like on the spot? And I was thinking, I don't know if you want to do this like just as an example, because you could use ITR from like how much information you knew about your ideal client profile and your strategic plan or if you wanted to use maybe a different client without giving out the client name. But I think you've done such a good job in other podcasts that we've done where being able to answer a series of questions is the point.
[00:15:59] Speaker B: Right.
[00:15:59] Speaker A: Because like those series of questions that you can answer on the fly is baked into your messaging, your marketing, your ads, your telemarketing, all of those things. But you have to have every, all of that foundational information to be able to answer first.
[00:16:16] Speaker B: Yeah. So the milestone covers and I'm fine interchangeably using strategic planning because the revenue architecture is strategic and it is a plan, so it qualifies under that. But it, so I'm just looking over here because I have them all listed in the milestone. We cover the ideal customer profile, the winning position and then doing a product product matrix to your ideal customer profile. A total, total addressable market quantified. Not qual, not, not qualified, but quantified the submarkets prioritized market. What is your market focus?
What are your offers and map them to the submarkets, your competitive advantages. True competitive advantages, not we've been in business for 60 years.
And then what is your overall revenue arc story?
And so in all of that you have to determine a couple of things too. Like what is your what is your true brand identity?
Like, who do you want people to see when they see your brand? Do they want you them to see you as Kim, the fun spunky CRO brain? Or do they want to see me as a serious like Ryan wearing a
[00:17:28] Speaker A: tie or a black T shirt?
[00:17:30] Speaker B: Exactly. Can I show up wearing a baseball cap today?
Right. So all of that has to be thought through because your voice is going to depend on that. And but all of that comes from identity during that step of your ideal customer profile. Because if I identify that my ideal customer profile really hates me wearing baseball caps to our meeting, then I immediately have identified that my ideal customer profile does not match the voice and the brand identity that I'm going for. And something has to change. I as the Owner now have to decide do I want to go after this ICP or do I need to change my products and my services that I'm offering to align with the ICP ideal customer profile that matches the voice and the identity. And for some owners this is a really easy decision to go through. And other owners it's a really difficult, thought provoking conversation because it's well, this is my company and I can do what I want. Yes, you can. But if you want it to be as successful as possible and predictable as possible, then it has to be in alignment.
[00:18:36] Speaker A: There's a lot there, which is awesome. The so let's go through some of those and like give some examples and like go through what people should be able to answer. Because like in when I say be able to answer, like so those are a lot of good concepts and a lot of stuff that we help people walk through and, and to loop in one of our earlier points, like all of those things that you mentioned need to be extracted from people's heads and their leadership team documented. That's what allows people and AI to build out ads, landing pages, telecom or telemarketing scripts, all of that stuff because you have the assets. So it's this process of extracting from your head and your leadership team these, these answers.
And so as we go through them, maybe explaining a little bit more about what they are, but then like giving examples of how someone would answer it. So you like, you know, what is. What does a good answer look like versus not like what's a fluffy answer? That's kind of like, you know, like you always, you and I always joke like scale 1 through 10, can't use 7 because it's a non answer. And I think there's a lot of people where they want to have a quick answer to feel the progress, but that doesn't help them, their team or AI.
And so we want real answers, which I think you alluded to is it's tough for people because they're deciding they're saying no to a bunch of stuff. So we're trying to help them decide and to lock stuff in and then through the user journey you're testing out those decisions.
[00:20:10] Speaker B: Yeah, 100%. So question. The great place to start with the line of questioning is why did you start this business in the first place?
And just be honest with yourself and record yourself going through a rift. Like this is not a high end output at all. This is I had a dream, I had a vision, I wanted to make money. I enjoy doing whatever the case may Be another follow up. Great question is, so what keeps you passionate about the business?
And then see what they mentioned. I love the people that I work with. I love the clients that I work with. And then it's just all wise after that. Why, why, why? And then just keep asking them why until they finally have like this beautiful, like, thought process on why this entity exists and why they're there for the world, basically. And from there. And all of that in AI is gold.
[00:21:06] Speaker A: Yeah. And to add to that, Peter Diamante's in his Moonshots podcast and his books, Bold and Abundance, they call it the massive transformative purpose that every company should have. And I love that it's not just a mission, it's like a massive transformative purpose that is helping people orient around something that's passionate and purposeful.
[00:21:24] Speaker B: I love that. I like it worded that way. So from the AI, it can actually, after that conversation, help you build out a lot of the other steps because once it has all of that in there, you can ask AI questions like, knowing all of this about me and my business, what would you recommend as a voice to represent me?
And then looking at what it is that I'm doing, what do you see as the ideal customer profile and why the firmographics, demographics, psychographics, and asking for those three pieces. And then look through it. Do the two of them match? And then again, working with AI as a tool is amazing now for all of this stuff because it's just, they're helping you think through your scenario and your circumstances and your preferences.
[00:22:14] Speaker A: Can you walk through what those three are? Because, so, like, and before I. Before you keep going. So the purpose of that rift and all that is to, to land on the ideal client profile. And so maybe, like, maybe we give IBDS ideal client profile because, you know, I want to help people understand, like, and then you, you walk through those three filters where it took me years, Kim, of like, we're not working for private equity firms, we're not working for nonprofits, we're not working for public companies or people. Like, it's the owner operator who has a job and an asset who, like, I mean, so we walked through and then like, you and I have even gone through as far as, like, they're curious people, they're willing to do hard work for return. They're not looking for the easy button. They care about their employees, they care about their community. And I could go on and on and on because I, like, we've.
I didn't do this like you did.
[00:23:09] Speaker B: I Did that.
[00:23:10] Speaker A: It took me 12 years.
I was like, oh, shocking. It's exactly like my dad and I, we were our deal client profile.
[00:23:20] Speaker B: Right.
[00:23:20] Speaker A: Because that was my journey, my story. But, and that's, I think that's back to your earlier point. Like, why did you start this business or why did you buy this business? It's probably similar to a problem or issue or passion that you had that led you into it.
And that's the same thing that your clients are probably dealing with. But being able to answer all of those questions and like, you know, you and I, we jump on these calls. We have one person wearing a tie and it's because they sold their company and they're at the buyers. I'm like, I don't know, I feel so uncomfortable. Why are you wearing a tie? And so like we have that, but then it's embodied into then our email voice.
Then like the show notes voice. Like we want to be speaking to people. And like how that. But then like the written lessons versus emails versus I mean, so it becomes even into the. Onto the website, it starts to translate through all of those different aspects. But you walk through like three different types of ways to find that. What'd you say? Psychographics.
[00:24:23] Speaker B: It's thermographics, demographics and psychographics.
[00:24:26] Speaker A: You want to give a little bit of an overview of what those are.
[00:24:28] Speaker B: Sure. So your firmographics are just analytics about the company itself. So of the ideal customer.
So those are a lot of the time things that people put together. 15 million regionally based stuff like that. They have small customers, they're zoominfo died kind of stuff. Yeah, yeah. So that's your usual stuff people put together. Then your demographics are simple like gender, age, stuff like that. And that's because there's always a different preference based on generations and stuff. And then the psychographics are like the pain points, the anxieties, the stressors, the things that gets them excited, the things that doesn't get them excited. I would even take it so far as like some buyer purchasing behaviors. Because of those things you can find what are their purchasing behaviors? Because you don't have all that information. And so all three are needed. Not just our target is 50 million to 100 million a year in EBITDA and they're located in the United States.
[00:25:30] Speaker A: Got it. Okay. What I'm pulling up right now. So the.
Oh my gosh. I want to see if I can find it. So there is what I'm looking for here. So I'm going to give a big Shout out to Bill.
So Bill owns an auto body shop. And he was on.
[00:25:46] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:25:47] Speaker A: So, okay, because I want to see if we can put this in the link for everybody. Because, like, he was so clear, everybody on his ICP because he did all this work. I don't know if I'm gonna be able to find it, Kim.
[00:26:01] Speaker B: I'm sure I could find it.
[00:26:02] Speaker A: So.
So what he did is because he, like, I think it's Lisa because it's an auto body shop. And he was so clear on his icp. He had AI build him an entire album about Lisa.
Oh, my God.
[00:26:19] Speaker B: Hilarious.
[00:26:20] Speaker A: It was like, next level. And I was listening to it and was like, like. And I think that is, like, so such a good data point. Like, if you can build a song about someone's issues and their problems and their desires, like, you're on track.
[00:26:36] Speaker B: I found it. You did? Yeah.
[00:26:39] Speaker A: Oh, my God. We gotta put that in the link.
There's an auto body shop, and if everybody wants to, like, check it out, we'll put it in the link because, like, he nailed it. Right? So then it's the radio ads, it's the, the mailers, it's the, you know, the, the, the ads online. I mean, it was so cool.
[00:26:55] Speaker B: Yep.
[00:26:56] Speaker A: It's like, thank you, Kim and Ryan. It's like, okay, well, we didn't know you were going to become an artist because of this. Like, you need to play that in the shop all the time, just on loop. Like, your texts are going to kill you.
[00:27:07] Speaker B: Sales team must have it memorized.
[00:27:10] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:27:11] Speaker B: Oh, yeah. So the icp, breaking it down into those three and to your point, why? It fuels everything else. Your brand, voice.
I mean, even little things between can you say hey in an email or hi, or is it hello? I really hate getting emails that start with hello because it makes me feel like I'm in trouble. Just FYI, if you're ever upset with me for something that I've done, just start the email.
Like, oh,
[00:27:39] Speaker A: that's so interesting. Whether you use emojis or don't use emojis. You know, one thing that I, I, I think, I think Taki Moore is an absolute genius with this stuff because he, he's the, the million dollar coach that I, I read the book, joined the program. That's the whole point of IBDs where I got the IBD group coaching. How to have the playbook, how to deliver the material. And, like, every time I get an email, I'm like, I feel like he's talking directly to me.
And it's crazy. And like Taki, like when I was at his conference, he wears like, like I don't even know how to describe his outfit. It's just totally talking. He's got bare feet and he just was like, he's 100% Taki all the time. But that's why people love him. And I think I'm curious on what your thoughts are for people as they're trying to find their ideal client profile, their brand identity.
It has to match with the what, what the services that they're providing. And I think you had some product thing I want, so I want to get to that next. But I think when we lock this in, it feels so freaking natural that like me, like, I mean I spent $30,000 with Taki one like when I like there was not, like there wasn't 30 grand just sitting around to, to invest. I was like, this is a no brainer because he totally gets me.
And like that's what we all want from our customers. Right? But I think what's interesting and that I think is nerve wracking for me and for a lot of other owners is if you're truly yourself, you're going to alienate a bunch of people. Like they're. I know, I swear. And I shouldn't. Like, I know that I'm a lot and I'm intense and like, you know, like it's only. But I can't not be myself. I'm going to try and mute some of the edges, but it becomes very nerve wracking to be yourself and like. And how do you translate that into a brand? Like, I know I've got a coaching brand and we're working on building that into an ibd.
And if you're the boiler company, the autobottle company or commercial cleaning or manufacturer, like, you don't necessarily want to like have the owner be the face. Like, so I know that there's a difference. And so maybe you can speak to how do you turn this into a brand identity but also being okay that you're gonna push some people away.
Because if you push some people away, you're gonna attract the right person and. Cause like being vanilla, like Taki says, like, being vanilla is the death blow for any company because it's like you're going to resonate with no people.
[00:30:01] Speaker B: Yeah, well, yeah. And vanilla isn't gonna get you to stand out. And the whole goal is that way. You're like the beacon of light in your industry that everybody can see through all the other businesses that exist and it's different based on what type of business you are. So like manufacturing. Some of my manufacturing clients, obviously they're. The owner isn't like the direct face. It's not painted on the side of the building.
But the owner's core values are the business's core values. And so that way every decision that's made as a business decision is thrown up against these core values. And if the answer is unknown or maybe not, then it doesn't happen in the business.
And then therefore, the business reflects the value system that the owner has. And so I think that that connection can still exist in that type of.
[00:30:53] Speaker A: What are some of the core values that are not total bullshit? Like integrity and like. And I mean, so yeah, yeah. What are your.
[00:31:01] Speaker B: What.
[00:31:01] Speaker A: What's your way or like how would you describe. How would to have a brand have personality and values that's not directly a face.
What are. What are good. Some. Some good success stories. You could think of trying to think
[00:31:18] Speaker B: of how they ended up wording this one, but I really liked it. It was something.
It's the age old.
I will treat you the same way that I want to be treated right. And that was one of their things that they had that was plastered everywhere. Is that treat like you will treat me the way that you want me to treat you or something like that. Like, it was. It was kind of neat. So the purpose of that was let's look at the other person as if they were us and always want to behave to them in the way that we want people to behave to us. And so it was always putting the other person's feelings first.
I like that better than the integrity or honesty and stuff like that so you can get creative with. And again the question why gets added. So if somebody starts with a list and this is what they usually do, they start with a list of like 6 to 10 that they say, these are my core communication, honesty, this and that. And then just start asking why.
This is like the platitudes and just ask why. Why is that important? Why is it important to be honest? Well, because when you lie, it diminishes trust. Well, why is it important not to diminish trust? Well, because when you diminish trust.
And again, just that simple question, why I feel like a child, I think goes back to what you were saying, being curious. Why is that? Why is that? Why do I feel that way? You'll really unpack some. Some good diamonds that were hiding under there.
[00:32:38] Speaker A: And the purpose behind doing all like. And I cannot emphasize this enough pulling this into actual, like, like transcriptions.
So there's a folder that AI can absorb all of this for is what allows AI to write landing pages emails where it's not like M dashes and emojis and yay, Kim, you're the best. Like, like, we. We're constantly refining it, right? Because it, I mean, God, how much does quad have on us? Like, I mean, 500 podcasts. I mean, it's got to be, I mean, 10,000 hours of stuff. And like, how we're refining. But like, a podcast is different than show notes, is different than an email, is different than like, landing page. And we're trying to resonate with the people that we want to resonate with.
[00:33:28] Speaker B: Right.
[00:33:28] Speaker A: I mean, so that's the purpose of, like, what you were saying of like, constantly answering why. So said, hopefully more succinctly, is having a list of core values on your, like, lunch break wall is different than all of the explanation you just said that is necessary to feed the machine.
[00:33:46] Speaker B: Yes, yes, exactly. The more you can feed the machine at the core level of information, the better output you're going to have in your campaigns.
It's not going to be generic. It's not going to be something that 10 other competitor companies could have sent out. That's going to be very unique to you and it's going to feel unique to you. Just like you were saying, the talking emails feel unique to you.
[00:34:12] Speaker A: So. Okay, one other thing I want to add to that now. I want to move to how we have to make sure that that fits with the product and the service that people are. Because you could be all of that goofy talkie.
And if you're selling something to bankers, it's probably not going to work.
[00:34:28] Speaker B: Probably not. I seen his emails.
I have to read I shit my pants last night.
[00:34:35] Speaker A: And then, oh, my God, what is that email? And like, like, spoiler alert for Everybody. Jackie took 25 grams of creatine prior to a workshop and he literally couldn't do it because.
[00:34:44] Speaker B: And.
[00:34:44] Speaker A: And then he sends the email out to everybody. Like, I couldn't do the workshop last night because I was myself. I'm like, oh, God, that's hilarious.
[00:34:51] Speaker B: And.
[00:34:52] Speaker A: But, like, probably not going to work to bankers.
So I think that that helps with, like, the product pricing or not the product fit as well because you could have a goofy owner and the wrong customers. And so how do you think about the balance between those two?
[00:35:09] Speaker B: You got to decide which means more, I guess, is what comes. Like, like, is it my product and service, my coaching program? Well, Say for Taki.
Taki must know that he is alienating, say the, the boomer generation, probably like
[00:35:30] Speaker A: a bunch of boomer coaches there that just had fun personalities.
[00:35:34] Speaker B: I don't know. That could be. But like, what is that? He must be alienating some of them, right? Or maybe it's different personality traits.
Maybe it's people that are in certain states that tend to be more persnickety than other states.
[00:35:47] Speaker A: Interesting.
[00:35:48] Speaker B: Like, so there is just. But he has said that's okay and
[00:35:53] Speaker A: it's okay for the coaching programs that he is.
So the, the product that he's selling is coaching programs. Right. So like, how does that. So he's okay alienating certain people.
But then the offering.
Because, like, and, and maybe I'm overthinking this, but like if you're a bookkeeper or I'm just thinking about all the most boring services, you know, like that, that are really necessity. Like, they're necessities, but like legal bookkeeping, tax banking, you know, wealth management, none of this stuff. Like it. No. I don't know owners that like, jump up, ready and excited to do those things.
You know what I mean? But like, they're all really necessary and we need good customer service and we need all those things.
But if they're, you know what I mean? Like, so there's maybe when I say I'm overthinking it, maybe there are just people that are willing to, you know, resonate with that type of goofy personality, even though the service is typically more like suit tie type of, you know, type of an industry.
[00:36:55] Speaker B: I think there's two things going on in there. One, yes. I think that there are probably a lot of people in that industry that have really good senses of humor that would not necessarily be put off because of some goofier branding thing.
[00:37:11] Speaker A: Maybe that would be the exact reason it would work.
[00:37:13] Speaker B: Right? Yeah. And then on the flip side of that, it could be.
There's nothing wrong with being that serious Persona either.
Right? Like, if you're not the goofy owner, you're the very serious.
I have double spacing between all of my sentences in my emails.
And you. Can't you use like past tense in your emails? Because why would you say I would have done it if you are doing it like that dramatically makes no sense. So don't ever put that into an email. Like, if you want to be that putting a box around it, then that's your brand and you're going to attract people that can either resonate with that. Maybe they appreciate that, maybe they're like, look how accurate this email is grammatically.
This is somebody I can rely on. Right? So it, there's, it's not wrong.
[00:38:10] Speaker A: Feel like you're talking down to me right now.
[00:38:12] Speaker B: I know.
I'm actually talking about career I used to have, and those were rules.
I had to use the double spaces in the emails. I could never use past tense.
You could.
[00:38:25] Speaker A: This must be very dramatic for you. Do we need to, like, get some therapy?
[00:38:29] Speaker B: It's just, I just wanted to like, rip sometimes an email out and see if it performed better than the double space email.
[00:38:35] Speaker A: So, so working with me is just like overcompensating for 15 years.
Oh, God.
[00:38:43] Speaker B: Oh, God.
[00:38:44] Speaker A: I, I think it's really important what you just said, because the faith, I, I, I don't know any other way to articulate. It's this faith that there, there is such an abundance of customers out there that like, I bet you if you figured out like, who are the people that need bookkeeping that like, absolutely have a infatuation with pickles, I'm sure there's way more than zero.
You know what I mean? So like, it's like, that's what's so unique about today, of our ability to reach the right people. If the messaging, the product and the service and the strategic plan all kind of align at the same time. I really do believe that there's that many possibilities out there, and it is faith. It's really scary because you just know you're going to alienate people when you start doing that.
[00:39:38] Speaker B: Yeah, I think that's probably not probably. I think that is also why we added into this architecture the total addressable market, because you can design it a couple of different ways and then do your total addressable market analysis and decide, does this meet my business owner goals?
[00:39:53] Speaker A: Like, is the talk about that talk about the TAM total addressable market. And then like, I think we might have potentially skipped a little bit more over the product service because. Did you say you had like a matrix or something like that? They were talking about like the product. I don't know if I missed that
[00:40:07] Speaker B: or missed it's further down.
So we have the ICP defined that we've talked a lot about, and then the winning position we talked a lot about, I feel. And the next thing is the total addressable market once those things are, are really firmed up. So recently I just did this for a client.
He and I spent like three months figuring out his brand identity because he was torn, actually. He's like, I consider myself like a super friendly Nice guy would give you the shirt off my back, but at the same time I'm going to run elbows with celebrities and I can be a badass. Right. And so those were two competing brand identities. So we spent time dissecting all of that and we actually came up with the hero brand that was the maverick and that resonated really well. But the sub brand to the hero brand is like the main theme. The sub brand to that was your neighborhood host because he loves to host neighborhood parties. He's the house that the neighborhood goes to to hang out and he likes to cook for everybody.
[00:41:10] Speaker A: And so picturing Tom Cruise in his outfit cooking for people now.
[00:41:14] Speaker B: Yes, yes, exactly, exactly. So once that was established, we then did the total addressable market analysis to identify what is like, hey, he has ownership goals, looking to sell an X period in time potentially, but wants to see it grow to ABC first.
Is the money possible with the winning, like where he is placed in his particular market and going to market with this type of story, if you will.
And he came back, the total addressable market is about two times greater than what he needed based upon the goals that he had stated in place.
[00:41:50] Speaker A: So let's talk about what is a total addressable market. Like what is a successful like data set for total addressable market. Maybe you can give us some examples behind what that is and that we'll come back to winning position because we might have lately brushed past that.
[00:42:08] Speaker B: The total addressable market, that is the percent of the population that exists that matches your identified ideal customer profile who are known to be purchasers of your good or service that you are offering.
[00:42:27] Speaker A: So how do you refine that so that way you're not lying to yourself? Like there's 6 million privately held businesses.
[00:42:34] Speaker B: Yay.
[00:42:35] Speaker A: Like, you know what I mean? Like, how do you, like how many filters do you put on that TAM where you feel good about it without getting too micro.
[00:42:43] Speaker B: So I'll use a customer that I was just talking about, but I'm just going to keep specifics out. When I was working on this with him, with them, we started with his entire market in the United States is we'll say, I'm trying to think of an example so I'm not being too specific. The food industry.
And then within the food industry, his service was only applicable to people, people that like to go camping and need camping food. So that narrows it down even more.
Yeah, definitely sushi.
Not marshmallows.
Definitely not marshmallows.
And then from there you look at like the, the demographics that's a part of your ICP. So if the percent of people going camping are the right generation, say 50, 20% are the right generation for you. And so you just keep narrowing it down by the factors that were established in your ideal customer profile.
[00:43:47] Speaker A: From there, what are the tools that you use to find this data?
[00:43:52] Speaker B: Currently, when I just did it for this client, I used Claude but I asked it to cite its sources and give me links to the sources so that way I could click on the link. That way I'm not just doing general generic searches on the Internet because there's a lot of different sources out there. Like Statist, Statista has a lot of information.
The Bureau of Labor Statistics and stuff like that has a lot of information. The Census Bureau has a ton of information.
Those are all like government free websites that are out there. And I used to like just search them rigorously and take.
[00:44:25] Speaker A: But now you got Claude that's just going through it and like Claude going back to like even help.
The more material we have in our database or folders, the more that Claude can enhance our thinking of like nudging us in the right direction.
[00:44:40] Speaker B: Right.
[00:44:40] Speaker A: With all this stuff going like well, more about this. What about the.
That's fantastic. And then you're layering on your values and like one thing that Greg Meredith always I absolutely love from his strategic planning process is values and doctrines are kind of similar. I think doctrines for in Greg's definition are what do we believe? So camping is fun. You know, whatever the beliefs are and you're baking those into your messaging and your ICP2 and the doctrines are the opposite rule is like you. The opposite can't be absurd. Like integrity. Well, not having integrity. Well that's not a doctrine then. I mean so like you want it to be something that is uniquely you because the opposite also is a good idea.
So like you know, if we wanted to figure out trying to think it like for us at ibd we decided to go directly to owners, right? So we're like we're going direct to market where like all of these other programs, whether it's EOS or scaling up Great game of business. The Exit Planning Institute, all of these certifications, the advisor is their client.
And I think that that is the wrong approach. So we invert. But like both of them, obviously those are good businesses, right? Because they've been proven to be good business. We just chose the opposite.
And so like that it's the opposite rule. But then inside that ICP insider doctrines and that will help us identify the TAM Then. Right, because we're just continuing to filter down to figure out, okay, given all of that, who and how many people can we market to? Right. I mean that's what you're trying to figure out as an actual number. And then do you figure out what the actual revenue is inside of that? That like the purchasing power of that cohort then and where.
[00:46:27] Speaker B: Yeah. What is their average spend?
Yeah. And you can break it down by different ways depending on your type of business. Some are applicable, some aren't. Like who's buying online, who's buying in store.
As an example, the average purchase annually, average repeats. Like what is the retention rate usually?
So that way you can look at all the different, the standard like revenue metrics you would look at for your own business is what you want to identify within your tam.
[00:46:53] Speaker A: Love it. Love it.
Okay, what's after the TAM then? So let's say we've continued, we're continuing to refine so we can say no to everything else and get more and more confident that we're going to spend our resources in the right place. Where, where would we go next?
[00:47:11] Speaker B: Identifying your submarkets. So in your tam you're going to start noticing maybe there's some regional differences. So now I have a submarket for the major metropolitan. Five metropolitan areas in the United States is. Now I'm dialing in even more. And so I'll give an example of why that could be helpful in your SEO on your website. If you started, if you optimize some landing pages on your website specific to the Chicago area, you're going to start pulling up more, more in searches from people in Chicago.
Right. So maybe it's a geographical thing that you start as a submarket. Maybe it's like I said, the online store versus the in store. Maybe you want to target both of them. So you list them both as two separate submarkets because you're going to have different go to market strategies for online versus in store. So that's where your TAM helps you start to identify what those submarkets should be.
[00:48:05] Speaker A: Got it. Love it. What's next?
[00:48:09] Speaker B: Let's see. So documenting everything, your market focus. So that way you have everything that you just built that we've been talking about put together and you start to document marketing strategies based on the information that you have found. So this type of marketing strategy tends to resonate well.
Trade shows are a great way for networking and I expect this type of ROI from trade shows for buy, sub market, so on and so forth. So it's just, and it's just endorsing the model or the brand and the model and everything that you put together by documenting it all and then having a little bit below that, some general ideas. You have not flushed these ideas out yet. These are just things that were identified during your research process. You don't want to lose, lose them. But because you will find that type of information during your research process where in your own.
[00:49:05] Speaker A: Because I know there's some other maybe that this is your product mix. So one of the stories that we teach through the advanced solutions case study and we've got that five year model, we've like we're integrating all of this IBD material into that case study.
I think it's most of the owners that I've worked with and my old business where you have multiple product lines and service lines. So you could have this situation that we're unpacking potentially applicable to multiple product or service lines. And there's a story and a trend that's going on inside of the product and service mix of the revenue architecture. Right. So my old business equipment margins are going down, manage IT and software automation is going up. We're trying to figure out how to reinvest into what product or service line.
I mean I, you know, I've, in the previous strategic planning podcast I've done like, I mean had we actually gone through a freaking thoughtful process, we would have saved so much money. Because the consultants who teach people how to build up managed IT services, we always joke they're the ones that made the money. We never made any of them.
Because after, you know, on 3,000 some customers for copiers and print like Valspar Worldwide was one of our customers, the Minnesota Wild. And like you have these very large customers, more gear, more equipment. Well, guess what, they have a CIO and a team in their IT department that's bigger than our company. They don't need IT services.
So you know the AnsOps matrix, the BCG matrix, are these different like matrixes to figure out? You know, there's the cash cow, there's the, the question mark, the rising star or different ways to think about. Do you like, is it new product, new market, new product, current market, you know, same product, same market. You know, like there's different ways to essentially place bets with risk. And I think that, that those are very helpful when, when you look at the product service mix trying to figure out like okay, what's actually going on inside my industry. Recite like other con. Is there a consolidation where you know, in the home services, right now it's like, well, private equity is in there and it's the roll up and we're going to do everything for the home. Like that's the whole, you know, the jam that's going on. So how do you think about these decisions?
[00:51:25] Speaker B: I think they fall very nicely in the next step of that offers mapped, where you're mapping your offers to your submarkets.
And then you're also doing a lot of the analysis that you were just talking about, like what is the upside potential? Like what are the tailwinds and headwinds. I used to always call them by product because some offer more opportunity than others do. And so you want to have that all mapped out and then which ones are going to, to like rank strongest performing with your ICP versus what's maybe a loss leader for the business but you use it to get new business in the door because you know those people are more likely to convert to these higher dollar, higher margin items. So that's the next step where you got to go through and map out all those different offerings.
[00:52:10] Speaker A: I know we got 10 minutes here what I'm thinking about because we, we could probably keep going into all the specifics. I, I want to get, I want to just riff here, give you my thoughts about where we're at with all of this material and AI and how different it is compared to where it used to be. And I want your reactions and some of your commentary for the.
It's a good idea, Kim. I'll try and be as, as affirming, as good as. As affirming as AI is. I think the, the power of advisors and consultants is an objective third party view into your organization where you don't have like the group think or confirmation bias or the narrative that you've had forever.
So even if someone could do a lot of this stuff, that ability to get the outside perspective is very helpful. And just full disclosure, like you and I don't do this stuff. We have a coaching program that gives the playbook to people. So I just want to continue hammering home. Like go take the Obsidian web clipper and hit the web clipper button on this YouTube and get the entire transcription and plug it into Claude.
[00:53:18] Speaker B: Right.
[00:53:19] Speaker A: We're like, I want to get everybody as involved in tinkering around with this stuff as possible because in the past it was like a 20 to $50,000 engagement with someone. You had to do this.
Now like I still think there's arguments for all these advisors that are like, I mean Greg Meredith does a great job. We Had a client that just used him recently. Like, so there's very, very, like, in real reasons to use these people. But, like, the chasm Kim used to be, like, most people didn't do any of this. And then the people that had the money that could write the $50,000 check did it. It's like, take the freaking transcript from this podcast, plug it into Claude or GPT and, like, the cool part is that, like, the BCG matrix and the AN matrix, people listening are probably going, I don't know what that is.
Like, and all the things that you just said quad does, right? And then, like, like, just by us having this, like, wrap up, like, we're like, the prompting for this. Like, and so, like, the ability to just get going and start working on this shit and building an archive of your icp, of your riffs, all that stuff.
I've never felt this empowered in my entire life. And I think everybody else, I get so excited that they should feel that way too.
And so, I don't know, like, what are your thoughts about how you're using AI for this? Maybe kind of just give us some ideas of how you're using it with all this stuff, because we don't have to wait. Like, I mean, it's just sitting right there.
[00:54:50] Speaker B: Agreed how I'm used. And I agree with everything that you said, emphatically and wholly.
Take exclamation point, exclamation point. Good job, Ryan. I agree. Couldn't have done it better myself.
I'm using AI differently than the general public that's listening to today's podcast is probably going to use it because I use it using IBD's vault, and people in the coaching program get access to that, but the general public don't have the immediate access to that. But I find it's so, like, this transcript, if I were to take it and I were to take a transcript with my client call, they started a new client tomorrow, and we're like, all right, let's build these things out and refer back to IBD's mile 13 milestone 13. And it would just build it all out. And it would be amazing. The client would be able to do it within, like, two hours. They'd ask why a bazillion times, and two hours later, they would have step one accomplished. So for the general public, I think my process would be the same as what you just explained. Take the transcript, start working on this.
[00:55:58] Speaker A: On a very practical note, build a folder called Strategic Planning, Revenue Architecture, and we want to document. So on a super practical I would create, when you say the IBD vault, it is just a bunch of folders, it's 13,000 documents and it will be injected into the software platform as we build that out, but it's just a bunch of documents.
So you say, okay, Cloud, we want to have the final state of our ideal client profile, our total addressable market, our product offering fit right like in like our voice guide. And we're just, we want all these canonical like locked in documents but we need to go through a process to create that stuff. So the process to create this stuff. So we'd have the folder with all that, with you know, those ideal documents. But then there would be the workspace which is go to your voice memo, riff a bunch of shit, put it in the cloud and then have Claude be your strategic planning advisor. And like, you know, whether it's the ey strategic planning or whatever, the best strategic planning person that was helping Jeff Bezos or Steve Jobs, you know, like, and then just build out all of that data and then that then gets used to then lock in that final document that then cloud or GPT is going to reference as you like when you pull up something say okay, now we need to write a landing page or do a campaign or have a telemarketing, you know, blitz. It's going to be pulling on all this stuff, right? I mean like it, it just is. I've never seen it this easy in my entire life. It's always been call this advisor consultant who's $40,000, wait six months, you get a huge binder and you put the effing thing on your shelf and like there's no adoption with your team.
And now it's like the exact opposite. Like you can start using everything immediately, adopt it all by your team immediately and it's the cost of your subscription and just doing it. I mean like there, like I said, there are still very specific reasons to make sure that people, you're, you're getting this done the right way. But I don't know any thoughts on this because I just, I just can't get excited enough. I mean it's ridiculous.
[00:58:05] Speaker B: I share that sentiment completely because I can't, I've had so many people I know start using it that were, yeah, it's something that's neat. Or yeah, I heard something about that. Or yeah, I use it a little bit for this. But as an example now Frank, he's got like three different AI platforms and he's building high end production videos for his social media for his business.
He's a bit retired military guy.
[00:58:32] Speaker A: This is your husband?
[00:58:33] Speaker B: Yeah. Very, very like that's my. He's a retired military guy. And I had actually one of my clients reach out to me and ask what video editing, like what video producer he was using because he wanted to hire it. Hire them for video editing. Right. He was so blown away by his videos that he was putting together and that that particular client is probably spending like $20,000 a year on a video team.
And here's my husband sitting downstairs with AI three different subscriptions and he's just, this looks good. And I like this idea. Or I liked it when you did this, but I'd rather you do this instead. And I really like this idea over here. And it's amazing.
[00:59:13] Speaker A: That's so crazy. Like Peter Diamante said, to sit down and talk about an idea is more expensive now than doing it.
Like to even talk about strategic planning versus taking this transcript and start building the shit out.
Just go do it. And like, it's like the, it's absurd to just guess anymore because you could, people can go through this, these exercises now and then get buy in with your team and then like, and then actually empower the team to then have a voice branding guide for the whole team, whether it's emails or customer emails or customer service. I mean like the whole thing, it's so crazy. And if you want the double spaces, you can put that into the voice guide.
Ours doesn't have that.
It's okay to swear every once in a while.
[01:00:10] Speaker B: I love it.
And I get to say, hey, what up, dude?
No, no.
[01:00:19] Speaker A: Em Dash is ever, ever, ever, ever gone. And it's like I violated the agreement. No, M. Dash is editing now.
Oh, that's the best final words. As we're wrapping up this introduction to revenue, predictable revenue, and this milestone. I know we got a user journey coming up and the data systems and forecasting stuff, but any thoughts about what we've covered and what's to come?
[01:00:46] Speaker B: I will just repeat what was said earlier. This is your blueprint for the business. It cannot be stepped or like skipped over. This is a very important step in the process. And if you think that you have it already done, I would challenge you just to rethink that. Go look at it from cleaner eyes and ask yourself, what could I have done differently?
[01:01:05] Speaker A: You know what I would suggest is plug in this transcript and have Claude audit it.
[01:01:10] Speaker B: I like it.
I like it.
[01:01:13] Speaker A: I would like you to be the best strategic planning on the planet. And please audit what I have. It's like, oh, I have nothing to attach. Well, that means you don't have it.
[01:01:21] Speaker B: I like it.
[01:01:21] Speaker A: It's a cool pet hobby. If you've got it, send it to me. And people would just stare at him.
[01:01:28] Speaker B: It's true, though. If it's just in your head, that doesn't count either.
And then where we're going, next steps for the user journey stuff, I'm super excited about that because this is a really cool part where you get to start putting things into action, tweaking dials, and then you get to see benefits from your hard work. And I'll give you a quick example. One of my clients got their first ever website lead, and they are in a highly saturated space where they should never really be getting any website leads. And they just got their first ever one. And I was like, time for us all to do a happy dance, right? Like, this is the section where we put this into place and we get to celebrate as a team when positive things happen.
[01:02:13] Speaker A: So that's awesome. And then I think it was a good way of wrapping up the.
The time it takes and maybe expectation setting. I'm thinking about that client that you and I were on the call with, and there was a little bit of hammering on your direction because they're in the IBD coaching program, but they've also hired you as the CRO and I was like, as the board asking a bunch of questions. And there seemed to be a lot of frustration on their point of, like, not being further along.
And then they explained because, like, everybody wants the funnels.
Build the funnel, get me more and more leads. And it was like. So there seemed to be frustration of, like, not making the progress. And then I asked about what you guys have done, and I was like, you guys have freaking killed it. Like, all of the foundation that you guys have put in was unbelievable because that's the foundation that's going to spin the flywheel.
And so it was this perception and this difficulty of seeing the progress that I found unique. But then, like, after I was like, wait, so six months ago, you had no CRM, Correct. You had no breakout. You had, like, none of this stuff. And now you have a CRM, you have a sales funnel. You have all these different things and you're frustrated. I'm like, well, of course, like, you haven't. You haven't reaped the dividends yet. Like, you're making progress. And then there was this whole, like, oh, you know, the whole Dan Sullivan.
They were looking at the gap between where they are and where they wanted to be versus where they are and where they came from. So any thoughts about like kind of just expectation setting, how to think about the engine, the revenue engine in general, versus just the quick hits?
[01:03:49] Speaker B: I have found the first six to 12 months, a lot of my clients get frustrated and antsy because they want to move on to something shiny or they want to start seeing the results.
I'd say probably the six months more than I think the 12 months is an outlier and those are the ones that tend to taste shiny in between sticking to the plan. So if they're really good at just letting the team stick to the plan and execute the plan, I would say that six months is pretty fair. But if you think about it, social media, it takes three to six months before people start engaging because of how, like, if you've never posted, it's just how algorithms work on there.
[01:04:28] Speaker A: So you're taking two months just to get the independence by design IO domain warmed up.
[01:04:35] Speaker B: Yeah. For the email. Yeah.
[01:04:37] Speaker A: Right.
[01:04:37] Speaker B: Because otherwise it'll get blocked by spam filters and stuff.
So I think it's.
[01:04:42] Speaker A: It's just so important. And like, that's why what we're trying to do is provide that blueprint and that roadmap because people can like, I mean, you have to like, let go and give in. Going like, this is a plan that's going to work. Kind of like what someone would do with a trainer. Like, you're not going to lose £50 in the first month if you do. That's surgery.
I mean, like, sign me up.
Here's the GLP one and the surgery. Here's your day. You will have never take it back,
[01:05:11] Speaker B: take it back, I'll put in the work.
[01:05:15] Speaker A: So I just.
It's so similar and you're relying on someone to say, hey, this is the right approach and this does work over and over and over again.
[01:05:24] Speaker B: Yeah. And most, if not all of the clients that I work with have been burned by agencies or other consultants because it's so common in sales and marketing. And so they're not. Their willingness to trust and just trust the process is really difficult.
But I will say, like my clients, that we have reached that threshold and they are getting the website leads in and they're doing their happy dances in their offices. Can't believe that this is happening. Are the ones that trusted the process and just let it happen.
[01:05:59] Speaker A: I mean, and I know you do a very good job at not bragging about itr, but like, you went from a few handful of people to like 110 employees.
[01:06:08] Speaker B: Right. I think it was 88.
[01:06:11] Speaker A: 88. I mean, like you. But you built a very significant, like successful and large organization that was a household name and Vistage. So like, I mean. And it didn't happen overnight.
[01:06:20] Speaker B: No.
[01:06:21] Speaker A: But then that brand became something. That was what you guys engineered. It didn't just happen and it takes time.
But. Yeah. Well, it's so. Well, you guys. You did. Yeah.
[01:06:31] Speaker B: Yeah.
[01:06:31] Speaker A: I mean, there was a. And that's what they. I'm assuming that had to have a huge part of that attraction of everybody. The 24,000 Bishop members know who ITR is and like that's. It doesn't happen overnight. But if we are slow and steady, I think it's the. The dividends get paid. Oh, my God. Because then the budgeting becomes easier. Figuring out what products and services you want to sell, what margins. You can hold your margins. You can make sure you have predictable distributions. I mean, everything starts with this revenue engine. Once we know where we want to go.
[01:07:04] Speaker B: Yep. Ascending troughs and ascending peaks.
[01:07:08] Speaker A: There you go.
[01:07:09] Speaker B: On your chart, if you see that your low points keep getting up higher and higher, like you're going to have ebbs and flows. So it's not like. Well, this one wasn't as good as last. So just the tip of it, a device, as long as you see the bottom continuing to go, it's compounding growth like Bitcoin.
[01:07:26] Speaker A: We need to see that higher trough, though.
Yeah, I know.
[01:07:31] Speaker B: It's.
[01:07:32] Speaker A: Cycles are important to understand.
[01:07:34] Speaker B: Yeah.
[01:07:35] Speaker A: And then it's all about perspective. And perspective comes from the timeline that we're looking at things from.
[01:07:40] Speaker B: And consistency.
[01:07:41] Speaker A: Yep. Any you and I can do some recon on the links that we want to put in here. We'll put some. I'm saying this because Claude helps us and we're gonna grab some of the other strategic planning podcasts that we've done. I don't know if you want to add a call to action of any of the predictable revenue assessment or something like that. We can add to that. Maybe we spin up a landing page and people can download that. Because that would be something that you could add to your AI project. Because the goal would be. Is just start. Start thinking about it.
[01:08:08] Speaker B: Agreed. 100%.
[01:08:10] Speaker A: 110%.
[01:08:11] Speaker B: Good job, Ryan.
[01:08:13] Speaker A: Alrighty, everybody. I will see you next week.
This episode is brought to you by Kastos Productions.
